Rick Villarreal

[wardly]

I get a little tired of members of this board ragging R.V. about his coaching hires. When D.D. left, we had a budget of about $250,000 for a head football coach. Rick took a risk with T.D., and it didn't pay off. It happens to most of us in business as well as life. With the new student athletic fee, we are now able to be competative in the market place, and I feel that Coach Mac will turn out to be a good hire, just like Johnny Jones and our previous as well as current women's basketball coaches. I admit that the verdict is out on Bedford, and now it is not positive. However,there is a lot of basketball to be played, so lets reserve judgement until seasons end. I have said before,and feels it bares repeating,that only those who have never made hiring mistakes are those who have never hired. It's not an exact science,otherwise there wouldn't be such a head coaching turnover in colleges. You need only to look at Texas Tech as a recent example.I was in health care sales and distribution from 1968 thru 2003,and using the same profile hired some of the best and worst sales reps in my industry. I am not looking at R.V.'s hires with rose colored glasses. Personally,I would have hired an experienced men's head basketball coach. However, I feel Rick's positives out weigh his mistakes in hiring. On another note,I attended NTSU from 1961 thru 1966. Until Rick arrived, the only dedicated athletic facility was a football administration building built during Hayed Fry's era. You youngsters may remember it as our old ticket office. In my opinion,and no one is perfect[ except some of us who post on this board], Rick,despite some misfires,is the best Athletic Director in our history. So lets cut him a little slack,and look at our cup as half full instead of half empty.Just an old man's opinion.

[shaft]

Don't forget the fanbase was clamoring for Dodge. The fanboy posts on this board were embarassing with their love of a unproven high school coach, how all the rich Southlake dads were going to back UNT, how every recruit in Texas already knew his name.

It was an easy move for RV, give the people what they want.

Edited December 9, 2012 by shaft

[cdizzle86]

I have to admit, I was one of those fanboys. It was a big risk and it didn't work out. There are no excuses for what happened over those 4 years, but I still support RV. He has put this program in the right direction in many ways, unfortunately he can't coach the teams and make them win. He's done his part, now it's time for the coaches to step up and do theirs.

[H-towngreen]

Same as the Benford hire. Everyone was pretty jubilant about it

[Tully]

I was starting my Freshman year at UNT as T.D. was coming in and I thought it was going to be a slam dunk. I couldn't fathom how that didn't work out: "HS kids are going to run to UNT, who doesn't want to play for Dodge, the "National Champion" SLC Dragons are all going to just move together to UNT" were a few of the stupid things that I said. I was horribly wrong and I certainly give R.V. a break on his hire of T.D.

[GrandGreen]

RV's performance has been a mixed bag just like any other AD. There are many things that you can put in the good and bad columns.

IMO the big thing that has changed with NT athletes is the amount of support that the administration is giving athletes. That upward trend started with the retirement of Hurley who liked athletes as long as it didn't cost any money. I really think most of the things that RV is credited with, would have happened under any competent AD, but that is speculation at best.

The AD over time is responsibility for the success of his athletic programs and in Texas really it comes down to football. RV has a very suspect record there. He could not control DD, not his hire. The Dodge hire was a fiasco and it doesn't matter how many fans thought it was a good idea; it was very risky and it miserably failed. The McCarney's hire at this point is questionable but far from the point of being called a bust.

Men Basketball because of the very high profile of this year's team is almost as big a factor as football in RV's evaluation. Unless Benford turns this program around quickly, and it doesn't look good at this point; this hire could be a big problem for RV.

RV isn't likely going anywhere soon, but if fortunes don't change quickly in the main sports football, MBB both in wins and support than he could be in deep trouble after next year.

[Green Mean]

Part of RV's job duties and performances includes the hiring of coaches. He needs to be held accountable for all of his bad hires especially in the sports that matter. Things are better now than what they were years and years ago but at the same time we can't afford to be content. We need to have high standards and continue to grow and hiring bad coaches or not being able to evaluate coaching hires won't help us.

I wouldn't put stock in what fans think...that is what we do...we knee jerk on highs and lows but that is why RV and clan is there...they're the ones getting paid to make the right decisions.

[UNT90]

Don't forget the fanbase was clamoring for Dodge. The fanboy posts on this board were embarassing with their love of a unproven high school coach, how all the rich Southlake dads were going to back UNT, how every recruit in Texas already knew his name.

It was an easy move for RV, give the people what they want.

I was starting my Freshman year at UNT as T.D. was coming in and I thought it was going to be a slam dunk. I couldn't fathom how that didn't work out: "HS kids are going to run to UNT, who doesn't want to play for Dodge, the "National Champion" SLC Dragons are all going to just move together to UNT" were a few of the stupid things that I said. I was horribly wrong and I certainly give R.V. a break on his hire of T.D.

Which is why none of us get to make 6 figures to be an AD of a FBS university.

Just because the fans want this or that and an AD caves doesn't justify that decision. If anything, it justifies the argument that the AD doesn't know how to make a proper hire.

RV should not get a break on the TD hire, just like he should get credir for the JJ hire. It's RV's job to hire coaches that run the athletic programs here, not yours and mine.

The problem is the timing of bad hires throughout UNT's history (and, of course, the complete lack of commitment to athletic success in our past is a big contributor here, trying to go the cheap route instead of dong what needed to be done to produce a winner) has been critical. Always the wrong hire at a critical time.

No matter what happens in basketball this year, a huge opportunity has already been lost because of this hire and the terrible showing on a national stage in the preseason NIT. Maybe Benford eventuially turns into a quality coach, but that won't matter because the opportunity lost at a critical junction in UNT basketball history will take years from which to recover. You only get a 5 star player like Mitchell once every 30 years at UNT, and the opportunity to build something meaningful fan base-wise from having Mitchell is on the way to being wasted. No matter what Benford does in the coming years, wasting this opportunity to engage potential new members of a fan base and losing others because of the disappointment that this season has wrought will damage the program for years to come.

Hope I'm wrong.

Edited December 9, 2012 by UNT90

[KRAM1]

Interesting...I guess, according to Silver, all these folks are "shilling" for RV and the Athletic dept. b y simply posting their personal views on the matter. Always have wondered why it seems to be OK to bash RV and everything he does along with pretty much every other athletic department staffer on the board, yet let someone post anything positive and supportive and they are "shilling".

Good to see some sanity on the board this day.

[GL2Greatness]

1. most any AD that had done half of what RV has done at north Texas would have left after Dr. Pohl left or for sure after Dr. B was fired because they would have realized they were in a place with unstable leadership

2. it is easy to say "hire this guy", but when your head coach makes 6 figures less than most coordinators in the Big 12 and SEC good luck hiring many of them in and even if you do manage to get one look at stAte and even places like Cincy that lose their coach every year or every other year.....it is pretty hard to build recruiting stability like that especially with the top recruits when they can look at Texas, OU, TCU, Baylor, OkState and others right in Texas and see they will most likely be playing for the same head coach the entire time

I am sure RV ask many candidates if they would at least give some type of two or three year commitment and most probably said "I can't do that".....oook at the Ashton hire she specifically told RV she was here for the long term unless one school called and to RV do you really expect that coach G is going to resign from Texas the next year and that UT will call Ashton.....I am sure he figured he had at least 3 years with her and maybe longer because coach G would either get it worked out at Texas or Texas would look for a coach with experience.....well how did that work out

3. look how long it took JJ to get something going in BB and that takes a lot less players to turn it around.....if JJ had left after year 4 or even year 6 then north Texas might be on their 3rd coach since then if you want to give a guy 3 years to get it going

4. RV is one of the lowest paid ADs out there especially for having AD experience when he was hired and for being at north Texas so long....who are you going to get to replace him with any type of experience or are you looking for on the job training

5. some might say that RV did not leave after Pohl left or after Dr. B left because no one wanted him....I believe he wants things to work here, but even if they don't he is plenty confident he can get another AD job or even an associate AD job some place that will pay as well or nearly as well as north Texas so why just leave when he doesn't have to while a younger AD would have probably left first chance for more money or more administration stability and much more program resources...hell at this point RV could probably get back into coaching at a low level in college and with any success be making as much or more money than he makes as AD at north Texas

6. most ADs are not exactly young so why would a younger guy leave a program where they make about the same money (if not more money), they have more staff, they have more administrative stability, and they have more resources to make their job easier and they have the potential to take over when the old guy finally retires or they can move to another major program when their old guy retires

7. as was said RV had 250K to get a coach when Todge was hired......good luck getting someone that would win for that and good luck getting them to stay longer than 2 years.....it is a 50/50 chance they will win at all no matter who they are or what they are paid and sure it is nice to say "well at least stAte has those two years to talk about" but they could have just as easily had someone that did not win or they can end up sooner than later looking at a program that has a hard time recruiting because they lack program stability and the reality is their boosters were who paid the freight to hire the coaches and update the facilities it was not from a massive increase in fan support because they were winning and the boosters paid the freight for the upgrade BEFORE they were sure that Malzan would win.....just like SMU......SMU SMU SMU SMU did not wait until JJ was hired and got the program to a bowl game before they coughed up money they coughed up money to get him in the first place......what do you expect RV to do hold a gun to boosters heads and demand money

I am sure he would welcome a check and some input on coaching hires and at this point if you don't trust him to make the hire then do what other programs do and cut a check to replace RV.....otherwise things are probably not going to change especially at north Texas as long as the budgets are in line, facilities improve, and gender equity stays in control and there are no major grade issues or recruiting/other scandals

8. the BOR and lee the idiot could care less about athletics and really the Denton campus in general the BOR for north Texas is a bunch of ride the pine types and "hey I am a BOR member for a university" types they have no vision they get that fed to them from lee the idiot and lee the idiot cares about econmic development plans in dallas and shifting the focus from Denton to dallas....VLR is not "athletics friendly" he is just not athletics adverse he never opened the check book at WSU or Memphis and he had issues with what Price was paid at WSU that helped lead to Price leaving so VLR is not going to spend cash to replace an AD and he is not going to open the check book for an AD with experience and a magic donations wand and a rolodex filled with coaches that come cheap and only win (as of that exist)

so RV is going nowhere anytime soon unless RV wants to leave or unless someone cuts a check to pay for RV to go away

[DJstars21]

Same as the Benford hire. Everyone was pretty jubilant about it

No, I remember a mixed crowd...

[SilverEagle]

Interesting...I guess, according to Silver, all these folks are "shilling" for RV and the Athletic dept. b y simply posting their personal views on the matter. Always have wondered why it seems to be OK to bash RV and everything he does along with pretty much every other athletic department staffer on the board, yet let someone post anything positive and supportive and they are "shilling".

Good to see some sanity on the board this day.

You know I was not inclined to participate in this thread. Unless of course it leaned too far on the RV butt-kissing side. But if I ever read the phrase "well, ol' (insert name of administrator or coach here) really screwed up on that one" in any of your posts, then I would be less inclined to apply the S word to most of your stances.....if you can call "apologist" a stance.

Maybe you don't like the word "shill". Would you prefer "plant, stooge, lap dog, or maybe toady?

[KRAM1]

You know I was not inclined to participate in this thread. Unless of course it leaned too far on the RV butt-kissing side. But if I ever read the phrase "well, ol' (insert name of administrator or coach here) really screwed up on that one" in any of your posts, then I would be less inclined to apply the S word to most of your stances.....if you can call "apologist" a stance.

Maybe you don't like the word "shill". Would you prefer "plant, stooge, lap dog, or maybe toady?

Nope...that would be asking much more than you are obviously capable of handling...dumping some of the negativism and bias that you hold that is. I just asked that you get an original gig and try not to just copy the other usual suspects. In your view...it's OK to be negative all the time and "shill" for the anti-UNT/anti-Athletic dept./the sky is falling and all is bad crowd, but it's not OK to point out that there is another side to the coin. Carry on doing the norm for you...it's pretty obvious that you are not capable of being unbiased.

So, let's see...what names can I dream up to call you? Like all of your bent it always does seem to come down to name calling...so mature, so philosophical, so open-minded. But, not in the least surprising. At least we can all count on you. Got any more good lines about the band? It's been awhile since you opined critically on that topic.

Edited December 9, 2012 by KRAM1

[NorthTexan95]

RV isn't perfect but he's done more than I ever expected in his time here. Our athletic department has come a long, long ways in RV's time here.

[GrandGreen]

1. most any AD that had done half of what RV has done at north Texas would have left after Dr. Pohl left or for sure after Dr. B was fired because they would have realized they were in a place with unstable leadership

2. it is easy to say "hire this guy", but when your head coach makes 6 figures less than most coordinators in the Big 12 and SEC good luck hiring many of them in and even if you do manage to get one look at stAte and even places like Cincy that lose their coach every year or every other year.....it is pretty hard to build recruiting stability like that especially with the top recruits when they can look at Texas, OU, TCU, Baylor, OkState and others right in Texas and see they will most likely be playing for the same head coach the entire time

I am sure RV ask many candidates if they would at least give some type of two or three year commitment and most probably said "I can't do that".....oook at the Ashton hire she specifically told RV she was here for the long term unless one school called and to RV do you really expect that coach G is going to resign from Texas the next year and that UT will call Ashton.....I am sure he figured he had at least 3 years with her and maybe longer because coach G would either get it worked out at Texas or Texas would look for a coach with experience.....well how did that work out

3. look how long it took JJ to get something going in BB and that takes a lot less players to turn it around.....if JJ had left after year 4 or even year 6 then north Texas might be on their 3rd coach since then if you want to give a guy 3 years to get it going

4. RV is one of the lowest paid ADs out there especially for having AD experience when he was hired and for being at north Texas so long....who are you going to get to replace him with any type of experience or are you looking for on the job training

5. some might say that RV did not leave after Pohl left or after Dr. B left because no one wanted him....I believe he wants things to work here, but even if they don't he is plenty confident he can get another AD job or even an associate AD job some place that will pay as well or nearly as well as north Texas so why just leave when he doesn't have to while a younger AD would have probably left first chance for more money or more administration stability and much more program resources...hell at this point RV could probably get back into coaching at a low level in college and with any success be making as much or more money than he makes as AD at north Texas

6. most ADs are not exactly young so why would a younger guy leave a program where they make about the same money (if not more money), they have more staff, they have more administrative stability, and they have more resources to make their job easier and they have the potential to take over when the old guy finally retires or they can move to another major program when their old guy retires

7. as was said RV had 250K to get a coach when Todge was hired......good luck getting someone that would win for that and good luck getting them to stay longer than 2 years.....it is a 50/50 chance they will win at all no matter who they are or what they are paid and sure it is nice to say "well at least stAte has those two years to talk about" but they could have just as easily had someone that did not win or they can end up sooner than later looking at a program that has a hard time recruiting because they lack program stability and the reality is their boosters were who paid the freight to hire the coaches and update the facilities it was not from a massive increase in fan support because they were winning and the boosters paid the freight for the upgrade BEFORE they were sure that Malzan would win.....just like SMU......SMU SMU SMU SMU did not wait until JJ was hired and got the program to a bowl game before they coughed up money they coughed up money to get him in the first place......what do you expect RV to do hold a gun to boosters heads and demand money

I am sure he would welcome a check and some input on coaching hires and at this point if you don't trust him to make the hire then do what other programs do and cut a check to replace RV.....otherwise things are probably not going to change especially at north Texas as long as the budgets are in line, facilities improve, and gender equity stays in control and there are no major grade issues or recruiting/other scandals

8. the BOR and lee the idiot could care less about athletics and really the Denton campus in general the BOR for north Texas is a bunch of ride the pine types and "hey I am a BOR member for a university" types they have no vision they get that fed to them from lee the idiot and lee the idiot cares about econmic development plans in dallas and shifting the focus from Denton to dallas....VLR is not "athletics friendly" he is just not athletics adverse he never opened the check book at WSU or Memphis and he had issues with what Price was paid at WSU that helped lead to Price leaving so VLR is not going to spend cash to replace an AD and he is not going to open the check book for an AD with experience and a magic donations wand and a rolodex filled with coaches that come cheap and only win (as of that exist)

so RV is going nowhere anytime soon unless RV wants to leave or unless someone cuts a check to pay for RV to go away

I actually read your comments this time. As hater of most things NT; you support RV which is a little strange.

A lot of fans of all teams have unrealistic expectations, however not many expect NT to compete with programs with a lot more resources. NT has and always has had budgets at the top tier of the Belt. So your argument that NT doesn't have funds enough to hire competitive coaches is flawed. In football, there have been successful coaches at a lot of Belt schools as there have also been in MBB.

It didn't take JJ a long time to turn MBB around, he did it in one year. It took him longer and a weak oc schedule to have continued 20 win seasons. Not sure what your reference to Aston is far. Good coaches leave for better opportunities, it happens everywhere and the lower on the athletic food chain the harder it is to keep coaches. Few if any blame RV for losing JJ and Aston.

RV didn't have AD experience when he was hired. That is like saying Benford had HC experience because he had been an assistant for decades. As far as him leaving after the Presidents were fired, why should he? You may think AD jobs at 250k are growing on trees and RV could pick and chose. I doubt it.

The Administration upgrade in athletic support along with the student vote for additional funding is what has driven NT to new heights in facilities. It sure has not been RV's fund raising.

Being an AD at any lower resource school is tough, no argument there. However, to suggest that other good candidates for one of 120 to 130 jobs which pays over 250K a year don't exist is silly.

[CurveItAround]

Sounds like a lot of champagne expectations on a beer budget around here to me.

Edited December 9, 2012 by CurveItAround

[SilverEagle]

I actually read your comments this time. As hater of most things NT; you support RV which is a little strange.

A lot of fans of all teams have unrealistic expectations, however not many expect NT to compete with programs with a lot more resources. NT has and always has had budgets at the top tier of the Belt. So your argument that NT doesn't have funds enough to hire competitive coaches is flawed. In football, there have been successful coaches at a lot of Belt schools as there have also been in MBB.

It didn't take JJ a long time to turn MBB around, he did it in one year. It took him longer and a weak oc schedule to have continued 20 win seasons. Not sure what your reference to Aston is far. Good coaches leave for better opportunities, it happens everywhere and the lower on the athletic food chain the harder it is to keep coaches. Few if any blame RV for losing JJ and Aston.

RV didn't have AD experience when he was hired. That is like saying Benford had HC experience because he had been an assistant for decades. As far as him leaving after the Presidents were fired, why should he? You may think AD jobs at 250k are growing on trees and RV could pick and chose. I doubt it.

The Administration upgrade in athletic support along with the student vote for additional funding is what has driven NT to new heights in facilities. It sure has not been RV's fund raising.

Being an AD at any lower resource school is tough, no argument there. However, to suggest that other good candidates for one of 120 to 130 jobs which pays over 250K a year don't exist is silly.

The way I read it (well, most of it anyway), was that he was not supporting RV so much as he was saying that RV was pretty much as good as our pathetic program could afford.....and pretty much what we deserved.

Edited December 9, 2012 by SilverEagle

[untbowler]

Sounds like a lot of champagne expectations on a beer budget around here to me.

Really the current set of coaches have at least 5x more to work in regards to facilities, compensation, and support than previous generations of coaches.

[KRAM1]

Really the current set of coaches have at least 5x more to work in regards to facilities, compensation, and support than previous generations of coaches.

True you are....but, still a "beer budget" program with the majority being "beer budget" sized donors. At least when comparing UNT to the universities most folks want to compare UNT with most often. It's getting better, but there is still a long way to go. Need three times the number of Mean Green Club members, need three times the season ticket buyers, etc., etc. it's a chicken/egg thing it seems. Some say, win and we will come...others say, given them the $$$$ and the support and we will win. Tough spot, but getting better.

[DeepGreen]

Win first, create excitement.

[KRAM1]

Win first, create excitement.

Agree...a few more donors, fans, ticket buyers & $$$$$ would help as well I am thinking.

[Green Mean]

Until you give people a reason to come to the games and support the athletics they just won't come. If you win and do it consistently then they'll start coming.

[KRAM1]

Until you give people a reason to come to the games and support the athletics they just won't come. If you win and do it consistently then they'll start coming.

Sort of a chicken and egg thing, huh? Wins bring fans and support....money brings upgraded coaching staffs and facilities which help create those wins. Which comes first determines how fast the Wins come. Tough job this D1 athletics.

[NT1978]

Sounds like a lot of champagne expectations on a beer budget around here to me.

I think it is more top of the Sunbelt expectations on top of the Sunbelt budget!

[untjim1995]

I think it is more top of the Sunbelt expectations on top of the Sunbelt budget!

That's not really gonna change in the SBCUSA, either.