Here is why you leave Benford to finish off the season...

[Harry]

1).  Hey we all understand including Benford that it just didn't work out.  He was classy through the whole thing, never pointed the finger at UNT or the fans.  This is not Blackshirt Darrell Dickey stuff.  So you let him finish out the season and you make the break as amicable as you can.  That way you give yourself a better chance to keep the talent we have here.  Benford is a good recruiter and it won't take him long to find a good assistant job.  Why give him any reason to poach?  Not saying he would even do that but in my view if you play this out nice guy  you give yourself a better chance to hold on to some pretty damn good young talent and signees so this thing is not a complete 4-5 year do over...

2). The best coaches won't come available until after the tourney anyhow.  Wren most certainly has a list and is doing work behind the scenes right now.

3).  Let Wren keep his word.  If you were going to get mad about this decision do it back months ago when he says he's going to give him the season and evaluate after.  To expect Wren to turn back on his word now makes him look dishonest.  This is not a Portland State type of crisis moment.  Sure we suck but its not something that can't wait a few more games and firing Benford now is not going to fill up the Pit or give the players any more incentive to play better.

gmg

 

[EagleMBA]

12 minutes ago, Harry said:

1).  Hey we all understand including Benford that it just didn't work out.  He was classy through the whole thing, never pointed the finger at UNT or the fans.  This is not Blackshirt Darrell Dickey stuff.  So you let him finish out the season and you make the break as amicable as you can.  That way you give yourself a better chance to keep the talent we have here.  Benford is a good recruiter and it won't take him long to find a good assistant job.  Why give him any reason to poach?  Not saying he would even do that but in my view if you play this out nice guy  you give yourself a better chance to hold on to some pretty damn good young talent and signees so this thing is not a complete 4-5 year do over...

2). The best coaches won't come available until after the tourney anyhow.  Wren most certainly has a list and is doing work behind the scenes right now.

3).  Let Wren keep his word.  If you were going to get mad about this decision do it back months ago when he says he's going to give him the season and evaluate after.  To expect Wren to turn back on his word now makes him look dishonest.  This is not a Portland State type of crisis moment.  Sure we suck but its not something that can't wait a few more games and firing Benford now is not going to fill up the Pit or give the players any more incentive to play better.

gmg

 

Amen.

[Wag Tag]

With 2 games left you bring up a very strong point!! (Sarcasm)

Edited March 1, 2017 by Wag Tag

[Matt from A700]

I agree with all of your points, Harry. However, he should not have even made it to his fifth season. 

[Army of Dad]

1 hour ago, Harry said:

1).  Hey we all understand including Benford that it just didn't work out.  He was classy through the whole thing, never pointed the finger at UNT or the fans.  This is not Blackshirt Darrell Dickey stuff.  So you let him finish out the season and you make the break as amicable as you can.  That way you give yourself a better chance to keep the talent we have here.  Benford is a good recruiter and it won't take him long to find a good assistant job.  Why give him any reason to poach?  Not saying he would even do that but in my view if you play this out nice guy  you give yourself a better chance to hold on to some pretty damn good young talent and signees so this thing is not a complete 4-5 year do over...

2). The best coaches won't come available until after the tourney anyhow.  Wren most certainly has a list and is doing work behind the scenes right now.

3).  Let Wren keep his word.  If you were going to get mad about this decision do it back months ago when he says he's going to give him the season and evaluate after.  To expect Wren to turn back on his word now makes him look dishonest.  This is not a Portland State type of crisis moment.  Sure we suck but its not something that can't wait a few more games and firing Benford now is not going to fill up the Pit or give the players any more incentive to play better.

gmg

 

1. By waiting as long as UNT has there will be nothing to hold him to anything. He will have received all pay he's entitled to. I'll also disagree that he's a "good recruiter". Good implies that he's above average, I don't think he built a better than average CUSA level roster. Obviously he can't coach at more than bottom third of conference level.

3. I didn't like his retention from the moment it was announced and said that I'd much prefer WB cut the dead weight immediately. I think Benford has already had multiple Portland St level crises: first ever loss to a D2 school; first home losing season in 13 years; lose 20 games three times; and unlikely to hit 10 wins even including the two gimme games and will not hit 10 D1 wins this season; missed the conference tournament.

Edited March 1, 2017 by Army of Dad

[southsideguy]

not to mention he has already left denton for LA.

[EagleMBA]

2 hours ago, southsideguy said:

not to mention he has already left denton for LA.

[UNTLifer]

4 hours ago, southsideguy said:

not to mention he has already left denton for LA.

Please explain. 

[GrandGreen]

6 hours ago, Army of Dad said:

1. By waiting as long as UNT has there will be nothing to hold him to anything. He will have received all pay he's entitled to. I'll also disagree that he's a "good recruiter". Good implies that he's above average, I don't think he built a better than average CUSA level roster. Obviously he can't coach at more than bottom third of conference level.

3. I didn't like his retention from the moment it was announced and said that I'd much prefer WB cut the dead weight immediately. I think Benford has already had multiple Portland St level crises: first ever loss to a D2 school; first home losing season in 13 years; lose 20 games three times; and unlikely to hit 10 wins even including the two gimme games and will not hit 10 D1 wins this season; missed the conference tournament.

I wonder how many more threads we can have about Benford before he is gone.

1:  I will argue on your recruiter comment, because if he is as bad a coach as you think; than how would you know how good the players on the team really are.   I think he may be a great recruiter, how else can he convince anyone to play for him?  He is not wowing them with his record or the sparse crowds.  

2:  All valid points, but before most of that; it should have been perfectly obvious that Benford was not ready for a hc job at this level.  The Benford hire was a mistake from the start, I've never seen such a poor D 1coach as Benford the first couple of years.   I think this had to be obvious even to RV.       

 

[FirefightnRick]

We are responsible for why Benford wasn't reassigned as he should have been years ago.  Any other fanbase would have raised nine kinds of hell demanding it.  But not here.   Here....we continue to come up with reasons why we should defend it.

 

Rick

Edited March 2, 2017 by FirefightnRick

[oldguystudent]

I'd love to be a fly on the wall of the team plane/bus for these last two games.  If I'm a player, at this point, I'm thinking nothing more than "Hey!  Free trip to Kentucky and West Virginia!  Look mom!  I'm in...West Virginia!" 

[southsideguy]

y

10 hours ago, UNTLifer said:

Please explain. 

The team has already left for la tech to play the last two games of the season.

[Army of Dad]

8 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

I wonder how many more threads we can have about Benford before he is gone.

1:  I will argue on your recruiter comment, because if he is as bad a coach as you think; than how would you know how good the players on the team really are.   I think he may be a great recruiter, how else can he convince anyone to play for him?  He is not wowing them with his record or the sparse crowds.  

2:  All valid points, but before most of that; it should have been perfectly obvious that Benford was not ready for a hc job at this level.  The Benford hire was a mistake from the start, I've never seen such a poor D 1coach as Benford the first couple of years.   I think this had to be obvious even to RV.       

 

How many more threads until he's gone? I have no idea, but since GMG is great at rehashing everything that's happened to UNT for the last 40 years I think we are in for a good deal more threads, even after he's gone. 

Recruiting: I just don't think the roster, as it's currently constructed and developed prior to the start of the season, that even with good coaching and leadership the team wouldn't be better than middle of the pack in conference. I think Benford's coaching drives the talent down to its current spot in the standings.

[GRN-WHT]

6 hours ago, FirefightnRick said:

We are the responsible for why Benford wasn't reassigned as he should have been years ago.  Any other fanbase would have raised nine kinds of hell demanding it.  But not here.   Here....we continue to come up with reasons why we should defend it.

 

Rick

Doesn't help when your biggest donor "supported him too long."

[KingDL1]

2 Days

[CMJ]

42 minutes ago, KingDL1 said:

2 Days

[EagleMBA]

2 hours ago, southsideguy said:

y

The team has already left for la tech to play the last two games of the season.

If so, that is another major disaster...since they're supposed to be in KY.

[UNTLifer]

4 hours ago, southsideguy said:

y

The team has already left for la tech to play the last two games of the season.

Gotcha.  I saw "LA" and was thinking Los Angeles.  Hopefully only two more days.

[FirefightnRick]

3 hours ago, GRN-WHT said:

Doesn't help when your biggest donor "supported him too long."

He never supported him to get a 5th year.

 

Rick

[MeanGreenHoops]

22 hours ago, Harry said:

1).  Hey we all understand including Benford that it just didn't work out.  He was classy through the whole thing, never pointed the finger at UNT or the fans.  This is not Blackshirt Darrell Dickey stuff.  So you let him finish out the season and you make the break as amicable as you can.  That way you give yourself a better chance to keep the talent we have here.  Benford is a good recruiter and it won't take him long to find a good assistant job.  Why give him any reason to poach?  Not saying he would even do that but in my view if you play this out nice guy  you give yourself a better chance to hold on to some pretty damn good young talent and signees so this thing is not a complete 4-5 year do over...

2). The best coaches won't come available until after the tourney anyhow.  Wren most certainly has a list and is doing work behind the scenes right now.

3).  Let Wren keep his word.  If you were going to get mad about this decision do it back months ago when he says he's going to give him the season and evaluate after.  To expect Wren to turn back on his word now makes him look dishonest.  This is not a Portland State type of crisis moment.  Sure we suck but its not something that can't wait a few more games and firing Benford now is not going to fill up the Pit or give the players any more incentive to play better.

gmg

 

1. That is called being a professional. Benford doing anything else would hurt him. I'm not worried about losing players on the roster. That is their right. And a new coach should be able to recruit anyway or we got the wrong person.

2. Not sure what that has to do with letting him finish off a season.

3. Wren should care most about his customers, and that is us. If he did he would have gotten rid of Benford in late January. Wren is lucky that no one cares about basketball anymore including me. So doing nothing won't cost him much. 

[GrandGreen]

4 hours ago, Army of Dad said:

How many more threads until he's gone? I have no idea, but since GMG is great at rehashing everything that's happened to UNT for the last 40 years I think we are in for a good deal more threads, even after he's gone. 

Recruiting: I just don't think the roster, as it's currently constructed and developed prior to the start of the season, that even with good coaching and leadership the team wouldn't be better than middle of the pack in conference. I think Benford's coaching drives the talent down to its current spot in the standings.

Every comment on the board is either about the past or the future, not sure you want to limit either.  

I think if the team was healthy meaning a sophomore level Combs, that it probably would have finished somewhere in the middle of the conference.   The deal is that Benford even with his horrible record recruited a very productive Woolridge and Lawson last year and despite his obvious to anybody "lame duck" status still managed to sign a couple of promising players Wainwright and Simmons for his last class.   Look at Jones recruiting his first first years at NT, Benford is comparable if not better.  

I bet that Benford doesn't stay unemployed long, and they are definitely going to be hiring him for his recruiting not his coaching ability.   

 

[Army of Dad]

8 minutes ago, GrandGreen said:

Every comment on the board is either about the past or the future, not sure you want to limit either.  

I think if the team was healthy meaning a sophomore level Combs, that it probably would have finished somewhere in the middle of the conference.   The deal is that Benford even with his horrible record recruited a very productive Woolridge and Lawson last year and despite his obvious to anybody "lame duck" status still managed to sign a couple of promising players Wainwright and Simmons for his last class.   Look at Jones recruiting his first first years at NT, Benford is comparable if not better.  

I bet that Benford doesn't stay unemployed long, and they are definitely going to be hiring him for his recruiting not his coaching ability.   

 

It's not just a combs and Lawson player though. He also brought in PJ Hardwick, GWP, Deandre Harris, and a series of quick fix attempts that alsmot always failed. 

Did he recruit some nice players? Yes, but I think his overall recruiting and roster management aren't above average.

Additionally, Benford shouldn't be compared to JJ's early years, but his later ones. We weren't anywhere near the same place as a program when JJ left as when he arrived. 

[UNT90]

Why not leave him in place?

Well, because I, for one, will never donate a dime to UNT basketball again. Ever. No matter if UNT wins a national title. But they won't, because it's obvious they don't care about men's basketball. Those that don't care don't win.

I've come to the realization that the UNT administration will never care about athletics near as much as the alums that are fans of the program. It will just never, ever happen. It's the reason UNT is the joke of FBS colleges in Texas.

And if you think there aren't those out there that agree with me, look at the number of grads that live locally and then look at the number that give two craps about UNT athletics. I'm very much in the majority, and UNT made me that way. 

The decision to allow this absolute disaster of a coach to walk away from destroying this program with zero consequences will kill it for others, I'm sure. 

But continue on dumping money into something that will never, ever give you anything back if you must...

[Mean_Green09]

30 minutes ago, Army of Dad said:

It's not just a combs and Lawson player though. He also brought in PJ Hardwick, GWP, Deandre Harris, and a series of quick fix attempts that alsmot always failed. 

Did he recruit some nice players? Yes, but I think his overall recruiting and roster management aren't above average.

Additionally, Benford shouldn't be compared to JJ's early years, but his later ones. We weren't anywhere near the same place as a program when JJ left as when he arrived. 

Ive always thought the quick fixes & roster turnover were a huge problem. He failed to build his program like most good mid major schools do. 

[Harry]