If We Go 0-12 Don't Be Suprised If There Are Some Big Changes

[pollock]

Hell, let's just all go jump off the high-five bridge because Fake Lonnie says we should. Never mind..... he'll just spew a few paragraphs of eloquent venom to get people riled up and won't come back to defend it.

I think we saw the coming-out of a pretty solid QB on Saturday. After Vizza's second INT, I told my wife that I was going turn off the game if Meager didn't come back in. I stuck with it, and Vizza played very well in the second half. I do have to agree that he lobs some passes up there. But overall, he throws downfield much better than Meager. The play where he handed off to Jamario, but didn't, was embarrassing.....

....but not as embarrassing as the defense. I thought we had something when the DL got in there and got a few sacks. Then I remembered that ULL has 3 OL starters hurt. Then Desormeaux and Fenroy figured out that if they run straight ahead for 5 yards, they are guaranteed a TD if Aaron Weathers can't get the angle on them. I can't decide what the worst part of our D is: 1) Pass coverage, although that wasn't a factor against run-only ULL, 2) inability to tackle, or 3) inability to shake a block.

Game ball goes to Brandon Jackson for a hell of a Johnny Quinn imitation.

[UNT_playmaker]

Ah, here we are at 0-5. Only the game against FIU looks promising now. We have a QB starting now whose passes look like punts. The only question is who will field them, us or our opponent?

It's Todd Dodge's way of waving the white flag on 2007. And, yet, for some reason, he and our genius athletic director who hired him will expect us to bite the baited hook of "rebuilding, learning curve" and a bunch of other complete crap. The athletic director may even come aboard and make a long post about it.

It's a joke. We've been sold. Or, at least, some of you have. Half a continent away, another man who interviewed for our vacant head coaching position last winter took his 1-4 team into Los Angeles and walked away with a win over Southern Cal. Amazingly, Jim Harbaugh did it with no high school coaches on his staff.

Schools who have been I-A less than ten years sit in the Top 5 of the AP poll. Somehow, they've gotten the resources to pay a real, bona fide college football coach over $1 million dollars a year. Somehow, they play in a stadium that's not on campus and it doesn't matter. They've wedged their way into a BCS conference with no football history or past. Just somehow did it.

So, here we sit. Watching our high school coaching staff stand on the sideline of rainy Lafayette. Desperately going for nearly every fourth down. Even though many were fourth and very short, we convert only three all night. The one in my mind that sticks out the most is the one where the "QB that gives us the best chance to win" was unable to decide whether to hand off or keep on a Fourth and One, so he did a little of both and we lost yards.

Genius.

As our receivers nurse their ribs and kidneys from the "QB that gives us the best chance to win"'s constant high throws, we are expected to sit back and just throw butterfly kisses at the whole affair.

Screw it.

The real truth is, our school isn't serious about football. Our new president knows so little about it, she allowed the athletic director to hire a high school coach. Then, she and the athletic director sat aside and tried to pump everyone full of sunshine when he then hired a full crew of high school assistants. The board cares so little about it, they simply sat aside and signed whatever contract needed to be signed. They're off losing the battle to get a law school. No need to bother with football when you're losing political battles in other more important arenas, anyway.

Our athletic department is so pathetic, the athletic director signs on and posts on fan message boards. But, because he can't do it every day, he has a flunky out to review it for him. And, like the paranoid idiots they are, accuse people who disagree with their constant circus of being assistant coaches.

Yes, it's absolutely true. Instead of going out and doing real work and fundraising, they are busy monitoring a fan message board. It's laughable to think guys like DeLoss Dodds or Joe Castiglione would do the same. But, there I go again, looking at other programs with authentic athletic directors and expecting us to have the same.

So, congratulations to Jim Harbaugh, who with "players he inherited" slayed the biggest giant of all-time, point spread-wise, in its own backyard. Unheard of because they only threw the ball 30 times...and only needed to complete 11 of them to win! What's more, their defensive coordinator only had 14 or 15 years of collegiate experience on the defensive side of the ball, the last dozen or so as a defensive coordinator. I wonder what he'll do when Stanford fans "give him time to adjust to the college game."

We can't expect that at UNT. With the third largest enrollment in the state of Texas, we must sit and wait and wait and wait. Even though our athletic department has already proved they can't raise funds even in the midst of a streak of four bowl appearances. We're relegated to bypassing the Jim Harbaughs of the world for high school coaches and their friends around the Metroplex. We're relegated to watching new stadiums spring up or be renovated on campuses with undergraduate enrollments of less than 3,000 (Tulsa) or on commuter schools campuses (Central Florida).

It's a joke. A hoax. Some of us understand it. Others, blindly, do not. It took no more than watching a QB on an 0-5 team to ramble 73 yards to the end zone on the first play of the second half to snap me fully into reality. I should have known it when our high school genius was going for two points after a touchdown in the second quarter! I should have read it in Fitzgerald's eyes all night as he kept glaring back at the sideline as he leapt for errant pass after errant pass and getting his ribs and kidneys pounded on worthless -2 to 2 yard pass plays.

Welcome, fellow UNT fans, to the domain of Rick Villareal, Gretchen Bataille, Todd Dodge, and the Fabulous Sleeping Board of Directors. They've sold us the biggest con job in the history of college football. Bigger than OU hiring John Blake. Bigger than Notre Dame hiring Gerry Faust. And, yes, even bigger than Texas A&M hiring Dennis Franchione.

It's a rip off. No more money or support until the carnival barkers are gone.

Great Post, Finch.... Really good post.... These are all sad but true, our unviersity sold us out, and they have had a history of doing so in the past.

This is a post of someone who really cares enough about our program to spill it all out.

Great references with the Tulsa enrollment and stadium renovation plans and UCF and their present situation.

Mean Green Fans must be the toughest in the nation to stick through this SH** throughout the years.

[UNTLifer]

Great Post, Finch.... Really good post.... These are all sad but true, our unviersity sold us out, and they have had a history of doing so in the past.

This is a post of someone who really cares enough about our program to spill it all out.

Great references with the Tulsa enrollment and stadium renovation plans and UCF and their present situation.

Mean Green Fans must be the toughest in the nation to stick through this SH** throughout the years.

You are a freaking idiot also. That post is so full of B.S. you should be wearing boots.

A few examples:

Our starting QB was the 4A Player of the Year last year and was starting his first collegiate game. Even with his first game jitters, he settled down and did much better as the game went on. You want a real read of his potential? Go to the game this weekend.

Our school isn't serious about football? Really? Then why in the world do you build an athletic center and position it to be the south end zone structure in the future stadium?

Comparing NT to Stanford's situation in mindboggling. Plus, Harbaugh wasn't coming here and Dodge was the best hire. You two morons are calling for someone's head in the 5th game of his collegiate coaching career. Neither one of you know what situation DD left TD and what needed to be done when he arrived. I'm sure it was nothing compared to Stanford and the BCS millions they make as part of the PAC 10.

Oh and Fitzgerald's catches for -2 and 2 yards. How in the world did he end up with 14 catches for 131 yards and 2 TD's catching only -2 and 2 yard passes.

I could go on and on, but have decided to rest on my responses to the two morons or the board. Go join ponyfans or baylorfans or hurricanewatchersanonymous.com

[Quoner]

Yay - Playmaker and Finch are friends!

[3XNTGRAD]

Yay - Playmaker and Finch are friends!

Or the same person?

[UNT_playmaker]

You are a freaking idiot also. That post is so full of B.S. you should be wearing boots.

A few examples:

Our starting QB was the 4A Player of the Year last year and was starting his first collegiate game. Even with his first game jitters, he settled down and did much better as the game went on. You want a real read of his potential? Go to the game this weekend.

Our school isn't serious about football? Really? Then why in the world do you build an athletic center and position it to be the south end zone structure in the future stadium?

Comparing NT to Stanford's situation in mindboggling. Plus, Harbaugh wasn't coming here and Dodge was the best hire. You two morons are calling for someone's head in the 5th game of his collegiate coaching career. Neither one of you know what situation DD left TD and what needed to be done when he arrived. I'm sure it was nothing compared to Stanford and the BCS millions they make as part of the PAC 10.

Oh and Fitzgerald's catches for -2 and 2 yards. How in the world did he end up with 14 catches for 131 yards and 2 TD's catching only -2 and 2 yard passes.

I could go on and on, but have decided to rest on my responses to the two morons or the board. Go join ponyfans or baylorfans or hurricanewatchersanonymous.com

Lifer,

Im agreeing with Finch on his points about other schools making progress in regards to stadiums and such. If you werent such a pinhead you would have figured that out.

I haven't lost faith in Coach Dodge or Vizza, as I have been begging for him to be our starter before the season, I will admit Dodge wasnt my first choice, as I wanted Jimbo Fisher, but I still do have faith in him, as did Bill Parcells and that says alot. But I certainly don't have faith in his assistants as Im sure no one on this board does, why don't you attack their posts.

I also enjoy reading your attack posts toward anything I write as it shows how much of a fool you really are, and hurricanewatchersanonymous.com wow did you come up with that yourself, or was that supposed to be a cut down?

[GangGreen]

I also enjoy reading your attack posts toward anything I write as it shows how much of a fool you really are, and hurricanewatchersanonymous.com wow did you come up with that yourself, or was that supposed to be a cut down?

Yeah, burned him!

[UNTLifer]

Lifer,

Im agreeing with Finch on his points about other schools making progress in regards to stadiums and such. If you werent such a pinhead you would have figured that out.

I haven't lost faith in Coach Dodge or Vizza, as I have been begging for him to be our starter before the season, I will admit Dodge wasnt my first choice, as I wanted Jimbo Fisher, but I still do have faith in him, as did Bill Parcells and that says alot. But I certainly don't have faith in his assistants as Im sure no one on this board does, why don't you attack their posts.

I also enjoy reading your attack posts toward anything I write as it shows how much of a fool you really are, and hurricanewatchersanonymous.com wow did you come up with that yourself, or was that supposed to be a cut down?

If you only agree with his points on other school's making progress then state that. In your first response you agreed with the entire post and started it by agreeing the Dr. B, the BOR, RV, etc... have sold us out. You flip-flopping on that now? What have I stated that is foolish?

Assistants? You also agree with Finch about having a staff full of high school coaches. Coaches LaCroix, Peterson, Gandy, Rausch, Vestal and Leftwich might find that amusing considering they all have college experience.

Your arguements are baseless and your don't know what you are talking about half the time.

[Quoner]

If you only agree with his points on other school's making progress then state that. In your first response you agreed with the entire post and started it by agreeing the Dr. B, the BOR, RV, etc... have sold us out. You flip-flopping on that now? What have I stated that is foolish?

Assistants? You also agree with Finch about having a staff full of high school coaches. Coaches LaCroix, Peterson, Gandy, Rausch, Vestal and Leftwich might find that amusing considering they all have college experience.

Your arguements are baseless and your don't know what you are talking about half the time.

This is the Playmaker MO - I have agreed and disagreed with him about 25 total times on the same issue and my position is not the one changing.

Just let him talk in peace, it could be worse.

[SouthBendGreen]

Honestly, I can't believe sane people are still posting to this thread. It'll go away if you let it. I saw this thread the other day and started to post a reply calling you know who an idiot and now his cohort too, but I thought better of it. Oops, looks like I just did that. Anyway, knee jerking is probably the most annoying thing that sports fans do. Putting a lot of credence into TD's ability based on this season alone makes you short-sighted and irrational, IMO. Do we suck yea, but to claim the sky is falling is just dumb! Very dumb.

[MGW]

The Fake Lonnie Finch is Scottie, circa 1999. SUE can correct me on the date.

[untbowler]

The Fake Lonnie Finch is Scottie, circa 1999. SUE can correct me on the date.

man if I was Scottie I would be offended by that comment.

[ParksAndRecRick]

Bro Fitch----Ye Fake One---I think you are full of The Ticket Schtick! However, you don't use it nearly as clever or witty. No more support you say? why don't you tell us about your financial support to the Athletic Department and University?

Also Bro---We will welcome you back to the Bandwagon when it gets turned around. That's what winners do!

Forever Green!

ParksAndRecRick

A UNT Insutition Since 1984

[Guest Aquila_Viridis]

I think he's earned a 3 year window to turn things around. Anything less wouldn't be "fair".

A 3 year window? Man, now that is some patience. Do you think other schools are just sitting around in that time? At this rate, in 3 years, UTSA will be rolling on us. I didn't have much expectation after this coaching decision last year, but for all the hype and devotion from some on here, I would think that they would have expected more than a total meltdown.

I would not go so far as Finch, though thank Heaven someone has the guts to say something like that. I am tired of the excuses about how adverse the situation is. They need to get on the mindset that if they are gong to stay in the game, it is to look good doing it. Maybe they have that intention, but that decision last year is showing to be not in line with achieving such a goal. Please stop complaining about the stadium until we are spending as much over a 10 year period on coaches. That is the better investment. So I don't think it is a 'con job', just too many excuses and a poor decision not to raise and invest more.

[PlummMeanGreen]

A 3 year window? Man, now that is some patience. Do you think other schools are just sitting around in that time? At this rate, in 3 years, UTSA will be rolling on us. I didn't have much expectation after this coaching decision last year, but for all the hype and devotion from some on here, I would think that they would have expected more than a total meltdown.

I would not go so far as Finch, though thank Heaven someone has the guts to say something like that. I am tired of the excuses about how adverse the situation is. They need to get on the mindset that if they are gong to stay in the game, it is to look good doing it. Maybe they have that intention, but that decision last year is showing to be not in line with achieving such a goal. Please stop complaining about the stadium until we are spending as much over a 10 year period on coaches. That is the better investment. So I don't think it is a 'con job', just too many excuses and a poor decision not to raise and invest more.

REVISED MID-MORNING ON TUESDAY

A 5 Year Window For This Recent Former UNT Coach To Reach or Go Over .500 in Wins/Losses...(No names mentioned, of course).

His 1'st 5 Years At UNT:

1998 3 & 8

1999 2 & 9

2000 3 & 8

2001 5 & 7

2002 8 & 5

A_V, I know many of us (just as yourself) have seen it all in Mean Green Country thru the decades, but there would be many of us who would only ask you to give this new HFC at least half the time it took DD to go over .500 (although I believe based on the work ethic of TDodge & Staff shown with their early 2008 recruiting committs that he will reach .500 in 3 years which is almost half the time it took DD to reach his first .500 season).

FWIW...........I don't think there are really going to be any alternatives for those who want something different for quite awhile.

Many of us gave DD Ball at least 7 years of support (out of his "amazingly" 9 years under contract). I think he had 3 winning years out of 9--almost an unprecedented almount of time for any NCAAA D1-A HFC to even reach a cumulative .500 record (which he did not accomplish in his 9 years). Admittedly, a very weak SBC in its formative years was just what the doctor ordered for DD Ball, but it did give us some much-needed moments to at least get our heads above water with the 4 bowl games, but that is just about all it did. In our last bowl game in the Big Easy, Southern Miss showed us all just how far back our "4 bowl trips in a row program" was to even matching up with some of the non-BCS school's best football programs. The USM game resulsts at the NO's Bowl was a big red flag for many of us on this board as to what we were foolin ourselves about with this football program.

Some of us actually think Mean Green football can get back in the Top 25 much like it did in the 1970's--that (in fact) is our bar for Mean Green football. Most NT Exes usually set the bar from the best times of their respective eras, but I think we all know that if a D1-A program is not shooting for Top 25 rankings, then what the hell is is setting as its goals? And I think all eras of the Mean Green Nation would really prefer that the next time we go to any bowl that we do so as a legitimate Top 25 football program, a la Boise State U (our former Big West Conference-mates). I cannot fathom that we would have lesser goals in Denton, Texas, America.

Like in the movie Bridge Over the River Kwai we, too, have a bridge at UNT that needs to be torn down and rebuilt (almost from scratch, recruiting-wise) yet this time around to be built on much more solid ground. Darrell Dickey did leave some fine D1-A players behind, but (again) just not near enough for Todd Dodge to have won this year. I mostly settled on 3 wins his first year, but whethet its 3 or 0, there ain't much difference between either number as far as how it relates to the Big Picture or down the road with DodgeBall.

I Found This To Be A Shocking Revelation.... According to the SBC TV color commentator for our ULaLa game last Saturday night, TDodge only had 17 "official" days to recruit last Winter--that is not even enough time to let kids know what our school colors or mascots are.

Who on this board would say that the 2007 version of the SBC is the same one we saw during a 4 year bowl run? OOC results even this season would suggests that this is a much stronger SBC than we've seen in the past, ie, even the recent past. This is the SBC that Todd Dodge inherited--no excuses with that, either--just the cold, unadulterated and blatant fact of the matter at hand for us at this time.

Many just think Todd Dodge gives us that opportunity to build a better bridge on a more solid foundation, but it just ain't going to happen overnight in this microwave age as well as need for instant success for some college football fans. (Anyone else think the TAMU "FIRE COACH FRAN" movement has had a bit of a setback the last few days? Yet to judge DodgeBall after 5 games with mostly players that were, in deed, (like it or not) recruited by DD. This was the hand that was deal't TDodge when he took our job and he probably knew coming in the true reality of the situation. For this team to have won the SBC in 2007, it would have needed to have been the same SBC that Darrell Dickey had inherited. FWIW, even in the 2001 season there had to be some uncommon miracles to win 2 or 3 games that got us to a bowl with a losing record and in the eyes of on particular UNT Chairman of the Board of Regents, bought DD another 6 years in Denton (albeit 6 years of only setting the SBC as our bar or standard of success. FWIW..........that low set bar in the early days of the SBC is what kept Darrell Dickey from getting not one NCAA D1-A upper profile school job interview.

Yet might even the most objective college football fans not associated with UNT in any form or fashion probably agree to the person that 5 games in a HFC's 1'st season is hardly a fair enough time to judge a program?

Anyone wanting to judge this program after 5 games needs to only refresh their memories as to the time it took TDodge's predeccessor to even hit his first .500 season in Denton as shown in the bold print above.

If some of our fans are going to keep trying to burn our barn down to kill what they perceive to be a mouse...

... lets just all quit kidding ourselves even one more second about all this while at the same time letting a hardy handful of our fans to face the reality of the one who took 9 years to build the kind of barn we now have--but at the same time even seem to want to (unfairly) blame our present UNT coaching staff of building this barn.

Edited October 9, 2007 by PlummMeanGreen

[Eagle1855]

[Cerebus]

This could be a great fund raiser.

Everyone votes on who to ostracize from the board.

Of course, every vote costs $10, but it goes to the Andrew Smith Scholarship fund...

Whose in?

[hickoryhouse]

Plumm, wow.

just wow

[UNTflyer]

C'mon, Finch... it's way too early to be going off the deep end on Dodge.

[Got5onIt]

A 3 year window? Man, now that is some patience. Do you think other schools are just sitting around in that time? At this rate, in 3 years, UTSA will be rolling on us. I didn't have much expectation after this coaching decision last year, but for all the hype and devotion from some on here, I would think that they would have expected more than a total meltdown.

I would not go so far as Finch, though thank Heaven someone has the guts to say something like that. I am tired of the excuses about how adverse the situation is. They need to get on the mindset that if they are gong to stay in the game, it is to look good doing it. Maybe they have that intention, but that decision last year is showing to be not in line with achieving such a goal. Please stop complaining about the stadium until we are spending as much over a 10 year period on coaches. That is the better investment. So I don't think it is a 'con job', just too many excuses and a poor decision not to raise and invest more.

AV,

I'm right there with you about the meltdown. I've criticized this coaching staff, and it's well known on here. I've stated before, something has to change on the defensive side of the ball at the end of this season. No questions about that. A coaching change and calling for Dodge's head is definitely premature at this point.

Edited October 9, 2007 by Got5onIt

[3XNTGRAD]

This could be a great fund raiser.

Everyone votes on who to ostracize from the board.

Of course, every vote costs $10, but it goes to the Andrew Smith Scholarship fund...

Whose in?

Cool idea.

We can vote for more than one, right, as long as we pay each time

[UNTFan23]

This could be a great fund raiser.

Everyone votes on who to ostracize from the board.

Of course, every vote costs $10, but it goes to the Andrew Smith Scholarship fund...

Whose in?

I want my $10 to go to the Stadium fund.

[UNT_playmaker]

I want my $10 to go to the Stadium fund.

Classy Post

[UNTFan23]

Classy Post

Great Thread

I too can use sarcasm in two word sentences.

[UNT_playmaker]

Great Thread

I too can use sarcasm in two word sentences.

LOL, it actually wasn't sarcasm....

I take it you are always in attack mode.....

gee whiz....