North Texas Football Color Barrier Legacy

[Mike Jackson]

So last week I was on the TRE Train and the subject of college football came up.  An older gentlemen brought up the fact that he always cheered for SMU and Houston cause they were the school to first break the color barrier in college football in this region of the country/Texas.  I quickly corrected him I pointed to my alma mater's logo on my jacket.  This has always upset me from the moment I found out how this major part of UNT's athletic history is not well known.  As a black native of Denton Texas that only found out about it after started rabidly following college football ironically after I left Denton for the Army.  This speaks horribly about how UNT honors its athletic history.  This is one the aspects that goes beyond just winning that even a "Liberal Arts Commuter School" student body should value.  Now it is only pure speculation but I sincerely believe that big part of UNT being left out of the old "blue chip" conferences had to do with resentment of our program for breaking the barrier first in the state of Texas.  To summarily dismiss it has having no negative impact in the "good ole boys" decision making rooms of college football in the 50's and 60's is quite naive.  If our program suffered the consequences  of doing the right thing way back then, our program should enjoy the rewards of doing the right thing all those year ago today.  I hope Wren Baker does everything in his power to publicize this positive historical moment  for UNT's athletic program.  Anyone local that is into college football should know this history and especially natives of this area who happen be black and care about football.  Coach Mitchell greatest coach in history and Abner Haynes help break the CFB color barrier.  And with Abner on his way to being AFL Rookie of the Year, AFL MVP, AFL Champion, Super Bowl Champion and Kansas City Chief Hall of Fame, its sounds movie worthy to me.  And the movie could focus on Coach Mitchell, his staff and the lead up their decision to break the color barrier and the success they enjoyed with Abner and Leon King on the team.

Edited January 23, 2017 by Mike Jackson

[DeepGreen]

Mike, I couldn't agree with you more.  As recent as two years ago, I had an email discussion with a former Sports Editor of my hometown newspaper.  I was reading the on-line edition and in the article he stated the SMU running back Jerry Levias (I think) was the first black to break the color barrier in Texas back in the early 1960's.  I countered with the story of Abner Haynes and Leon King.  And North Texas being the first college to break the color barrier in the state of Texas.  His comeback was that North Texas was not in a major conference like SMU (Southwest Conference).  I told him, in a nice way, that he was full of schit and that he should correct his story to reflect who really broke the color barrier in Texas.  To me, what conference NT was in at the time was irrelevant.

DeepGreen

A White Native Texan

 

[Graddean]

We were in the MVC which was considered one of the major, if not the major, basketball conference in the country.  Your friend probably thought college athletics did not exist outside of the old SWC.

[@UNTSportsFan]

Author Jeff Miller will be signing copies of his book on Saturday at the golden triangle mall : http://www.dentonrc.com/opinion/columns-headlines/20170114-jeff-miller-football-played-key-role-in-unts-integration.ece

 

 

[Christopher Walker]

4 hours ago, Mike Jackson said:

So last week I was on the TRE Train and the subject of college football came up.  An older gentlemen brought up the fact that he always cheered for SMU and Houston cause they were the school to first break the color barrier in college football in this region of the country/Texas.  I quickly corrected him I pointed to my alma mater's logo on my jacket.  

How did the incorrect gentleman respond?

[BTG_Fan1]

I'm not sure if it would help in recruiting but this would be something great to add to the kids and their families presentations( I would think). 

[UNTLifer]

Not that it made any difference but I used to write to voters of the Texas Sports HOF every year asking why Abner Haynes was not  in the HOF.  Leon King deserves to be right there with him. 

EDIT: I think my comment above was misleading.  Mr. Haynes was inducted in to the Texas Sports HOF a number of years ago.  Leon King is not, but should be there also.

 

Edited January 23, 2017 by UNTLifer

[NorthTexan95]

4 hours ago, @UNTSportsFan said:

Author Jeff Miller will be signing copies of his book on Saturday at the golden triangle mall : http://www.dentonrc.com/opinion/columns-headlines/20170114-jeff-miller-football-played-key-role-in-unts-integration.ece

 

 

I just ordered the hard back edition off of ebay.  

[Mike Jackson]

2 hours ago, Christopher Walker said:

How did the incorrect gentleman respond?

He said he would "look it up"

[jtm0097]

I am reading this book right now. It's a good read so far.

[DeepGreen]

2 hours ago, BTG_Fan1 said:

I'm not sure if it would help in recruiting but this would be something great to add to the kids and their families presentations( I would think). 

Tell you what, that's an excellent idea!  Those on-campus visits, I would make sure all the potential recruits, black, white, tan, know the story about Abner Haynes and Leon King.  This is a great selling tool.  Hell, if legal, give every recruit that you have face to face discussions with a copy of the book.  Pay Abner and Leon to sign the books.

Am I wrong?

[Cerebus]

The real problem is UH.  SMU already is very clear that Levias was the first in the SWC.  UH's official word is that Warren McVea was the first black player in major college football in Texas, saying that NT was not a major college.

That is an insane proposition, both UH and NT where in the top division.  NT was in a conference, UH was an independent.  Abner Hayes was on a team that was ranked #19 in the AP poll.  Somehow, that isn't a "major college."

This has been a burr under my saddle for a long time, UH refuses to admit it.  McVea was a fine player, but Abner Haynes was already the AFL comeback player of the year when McVea played.

It's not even like McVea has no other claim to fame, he was the first black player to play on an SEC field.  Abner Haynes would have had that honor, but both Ole Miss and Miss St cancelled their series with NT they found out about Haynes and King playing on NT's freshman team.

[GrandGreen]

I have several times on this message questioned why there was not visuals on campus that recruits could not miss commemorating the early and very successful integration of Afro-Americans in NT athletes. 

The last time that thread was highjacked to a discussion of why Joe Greene doesn't have a statue.   Joe should have a statue, but to me the much more compelling story is about Haynes and King.   

[FirefightnRick]

This problem all stems back to our culture of crapping on our traditions.

Schools that fight to defend their traditions would never allow it, nor allow its employees who control media to get away with it.  For instance, the people who keep trying to shove that stupid squirrel into our traditions ...would never see another pay check at other schools.  Neither would have Helwig after waltzing in and adding blue and burnt orange to the school colors back in the 90's.

Historically we just don't stand up for our traditions and have done much of the same for of our history.

 

Rick

[BTG_Fan1]

Not sure where they(Haynes or King) live or even Mean Joe, but this should be a regular thing of UNT as a school should fly these guys in during the season once or twice, these few weeks before signing day and maybe at the spring game.

Present these famous alumni to recruits, and have them talk to them during the season and now. These kids may not know Mean Greene or Haynes directly, but I'm sure these recruits parents do and having these guy come in would be shocking for the parents. 

Also, would be a great time thing possibly even do something during the spring like a donors dinner or something. I'm sure these guys would love to see UNT on top again, and would love to come back and be part of the team along with having an impact on these young men.

[PlummMeanGreen]

Abner Haynes told me a story years ago when he came to Fort Worth with Ron Shanklin (who was on a recruiting trip for Corky Nelson).  

The 3 of us were eating lunch at FW's Dos Gringos.  Abner told Shank' & I about when North Texas took a train down to H-town  to play a Missouri Valley conference game with the Houston Cougars.  

I hope that story is in this book;  that is, the story of what happened on that train when the hotel refused service to Haynes & Leon King because they were black.   I won't give that story away here until I find out if it's in the book.

GMG!

Edited January 16, 2017 by PlummMeanGreen

[UNTcrazy727]

What do we have to say about this? Does it not count since it wasn't the "highest level" like UH and SMU like to tell us?

https://www.angelo.edu/content/news/5813-asu-building-to-honor-kelly

[UNTLifer]

There should be a display in the AC dedicated to those men that broke the color barrier.  It should be the first thing people see when entering the building.  A similar display should be in the Union.

[FirefightnRick]

1 hour ago, UNTLifer said:

There should be a display in the AC dedicated to those men that broke the color barrier.  It should be the first thing people see when entering the building.  A similar display should be in the Union.

Agree, and maybe that changes with this new regime.  

A few years back (correct me if I'm wrong on the name)...sports reporter Wendell Barnhouse gave another school credit for hiring the first black head coach.  I and several others sent him an email reminding that NT hired Matt Simon prior to that other other school, to which he stated that he dismisses the hiring of Simon because he was first hired while we were FCS..then transitioned into FBS.  Well, that's bulsh-- because Simon still was an FBS coach here before the other school's coach no matter how you slice it.  

I sent this entire conversation to RV's staff and never got a response.  As far as I know it got brushed under the table like every damn thing else.  

Pisses me off as much as watching Aaron Rodgers O line get away with hold after hold after hold.

 

Rick

[BTG_Fan1]

Would be great to have these guys come in and correct it for a fact, Face to Facs with these recruits with them setting the record straight. Also, Yes the school should have these guys posted all over Apogee and campus.

[wardly]

Young people don't really care what happened 50 years ago. When I have conversations with them about our past they ask "who is Joe Greene"?

[SilverEagle]

1 hour ago, wardly said:

Young people don't really care what happened 50 years ago. When I have conversations with them about our past they ask "who is Joe Greene"?

To reinforce what FFR is saying. I guarantee you no youth in the state of Pennsylvania would ever say "who is Joe Greene?", because they take care of their history.

We however, do not.

 

Here is the original words to.....well....see below.

Now, I understand shaving the original two paragraphs, and our name change explains the change in words (dear old college and Normal), but what's up with changing the wording right after "dear old college"?  Who decided that we should change "forever in the right" to "striving for the right"? 

Could it be the same "mealy-mouthed-lets-make-North-Texas-as-irrelevant-as-possible" committee that decided that "Scrappy" sounded too war-like and proceeded to change the name to Eppy?  I guess they decided that "forever in the right" might offend someone and so in their "mealy mouthed" mission they changed the words in our Alma Mater to striving for the right.

Does anyone think that schools like A&M would tolerate something like that?

5 hours ago, UNTcrazy727 said:

What do we have to say about this? Does it not count since it wasn't the "highest level" like UH and SMU like to tell us?

https://www.angelo.edu/content/news/5813-asu-building-to-honor-kelly

San Angelo University was a junior college in 1953.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong about this, but back in the 50's you were either major college or small college in sports. North Texas moved up to "major college" when they joined the MVC. 

If we were not "Major College" then why were we invited to play in the Sun Bowl in 1959?

[rws69]

On 1/15/2017 at 10:21 PM, BTG_Fan1 said:

Not sure where they(Haynes or King) live or even Mean Joe, but this should be a regular thing of UNT as a school should fly these guys in during the season once or twice, these few weeks before signing day and maybe at the spring game.

 

Joe Greene lives in Flower Mound and attends UNT football games. I saw him at a UNT basketball game once last season.

Edited January 17, 2017 by rws69

[PlummMeanGreen]

On 1/15/2017 at 8:53 PM, DeepGreen said:

Tell you what, that's an excellent idea!  Those on-campus visits, I would make sure all the potential recruits, black, white, tan, know the story about Abner Haynes and Leon King.  This is a great selling tool.  Hell, if legal, give every recruit that you have face to face discussions with a copy of the book.  Pay Abner and Leon to sign the books.

Am I wrong?

How's 'bout an award-winning Beyond the Green-quality video & a mini-theatre created inside the Athletic Center for all visitors (including potential recruits) that  would pay huge dividends in telling the North Texas story to many more people starting with those in the North Texas Metroplex who have no idea about much of our history?

Yet another one of many ideas from GMG.com that will be ignored I'm sure.  Looking at the last 40 plus years of those we pay to be proactive & come up with ideas to spice things up maybe listen to the stock-holders every once in a while?  Stock-holders? The UNT students, North Texas Exes & Mean Green fans?

➡️ Giving credit where it's due, though, I still applaud the construction of Apogee Stadium at a time when America was sucking hind teat economically.  That timeline in our country a huge reason we got such a good deal on a stadium that the commissioner of a major conference said "North Texas got a steal of a deal." 

Edited January 17, 2017 by PlummMeanGreen

[Cerebus]

18 hours ago, SilverEagle said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong about this, but back in the 50's you were either major college or small college in sports. North Texas moved up to "major college" when they joined the MVC. 

If we were not "Major College" then why were we invited to play in the Sun Bowl in 1959?

I believe at the time the NCAA divisions were named College and University.  We where in the top division, Angelo State was not.