A Few Thoughts.................

[calvin]

Still dont have an idea how they will determine Player of the Year and 1st team honors. I am not so sure that Reed from ASU shouldnt be POY. Then you have so many to decide from and even 4 from our team that should at least get a little consideration. Where will Tyren Johnson, Yates, Slaughter, Hazzard, Rhonert, Pettigrew, and i am sure i am missing some others but you have to add George, Josh, Eric and Tristan at least in the discussion.

Then looking at it, I am not sure if it could fall like this but if it could this would be the best scenario for us. And that is MTSU getting the 1 seed, us the 2 and Troy getting the 3rd seed. Then i would want WKU and ASU to be 4 and 5 with FAU getting the 6 seed. That would mean WKU-ASU and MTSU would all play while we get FAU and Troy. Just my thoughts, anyway.

[Mean Green Matt]

I'll take the automatic NIT bid anyday, then let the rest of the seeds fall where they may. If we get the #1 seed, we should be able to beat either the 8 or 9 seed, and get to the semifinal. At that point anything can happen. I think our team will play better in the SBC Tourney if they already have the NIT bid in their pocket...

[Censored by Laurie]

Im sure I'll whip up something a bit more thorough and better researched after the season...but off the top of my head:

POY - Tyren Johnson, ULL

First Team -

- Johnson, ULL

- Slaughter, WKU

- Reed, ASU

- Pettigrew, WKU

- Odufuwa, UNT

Second Team -

- Hazzard, Troy

- Gantt, FAU

- Rohnert, UD

- Williams, USA

- White, UNT

Third Team -

- Yates, MTSU

- Taylor, FAU

- Roberts, FIU

- Vogler, Troy

- Thompson, UNT if UNT wins SBC, Haddock, MTSU if MTSU wins SBC,

[calvin]

After looking at the stats I think Johnson definitely should be POY.

[UNT90]

Im sure I'll whip up something a bit more thorough and better researched after the season...but off the top of my head:

POY - Tyren Johnson, ULL

First Team -

- Johnson, ULL

- Slaughter, WKU

- Reed, ASU

- Pettigrew, WKU

- Odufuwa, UNT

Second Team -

- Hazzard, Troy

- Gantt, FAU

- Rohnert, UD

- Williams, USA

- White, UNT

Third Team -

- Yates, MTSU

- Taylor, FAU

- Roberts, FIU

- Vogler, Troy

- Thompson, UNT if UNT wins SBC, Haddock, MTSU if MTSU wins SBC,

No mention of Trameil?!?! Oversight? I know he was out for some games in the middle of the season, but UNT would be lost without him

[Travis]

No mention of Trameil?!?! Oversight? I know he was out for some games in the middle of the season, but UNT would be lost without him

I agree. I actually see him as our MVP. Just look how we did without him.

I am sure that could be said with Josh or George. But, we really were a different team without eric.

[CMJ]

I agree. I actually see him as our MVP. Just look how we did without him.

I am sure that could be said with Josh or George. But, we really were a different team without eric.

I love Eric, but no way is he our MVP.

[TheTastyGreek]

No mention of Trameil?!?! Oversight? I know he was out for some games in the middle of the season, but UNT would be lost without him

All conference and POY are a stats game, and we're too balanced for anyone to really ring out on the leaderboards. If Tristan/Josh were a 10 ppg guard and the leftover 4-5 points were coming from the other, that one would be a 1st team lock and a POY contender.

As it is, Odufuwa's big rebounding lead and double/double average make him the only contender for 1st team, and even that is arguably an outside shot.

I love Tramiel, but All conference isn't an intangibles honor. I'm a huge fan, but you can't really make a case for him over Johnson, Yates, Roberts, Rohnert, Odufuwa... There are just too many other guys with better statistical resumes right now. Even if intangibles are a consideration, Gradnigo from ULL and Adams from ASU are arguably higher on the list than Tramiel.

[CMJ]

I actually think we're too much of a true TEAM to have much recognition on the All SBC teams. Just like 2007 btw.

[TheTastyGreek]

After looking at the stats I think Johnson definitely should be POY.

Even if the guy goes out and gets kidnapped by aliens tomorrow, I can't imagine Tyren Johnson doesn't get the nod.

He's got the numbers, he's on a winning team, and he's been critical to the turnaround there. His game took a quantum leap forward, and I just don't see how anyone else gets the honor this year.

[Side Show Joe]

No mention of Trameil?!?! Oversight? I know he was out for some games in the middle of the season, but UNT would be lost without him

I agree. Without him we are not the same. But I don't think the voters will factor that in when they make the selections, and I think he might get left off the list.

[FirefightnRick]

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I love George Odufuwa and think he's very deserving of 1st team player of the year.

But with that said....

....Ronnie Morgan? Whose that? Never heard of him. But I have seen George Odufuwa play, definately

the greatest big man in North Texas history of all time!!!!.

Edited February 22, 2010 by FirefightnRick

[TheTastyGreek]

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I love George Odufuwa and think he's very deserving of 1st team player of the year.

But with that said....

....Ronnie Morgan? Whose that? Never heard of him. But I have seen George Odufuwa play, definately

the greatest big man in North Texas history of all time!!!!.

Rick, for crying out loud... Who here said anything about George being the best anything in any period of our school history?

I'm 100% sure Ronnie Morgan isn't eligible in this discussion.

You're really tilting at windmills here, and nonexistent ones at that.

You know I love you and all, but this is really getting unstable.

Edited February 22, 2010 by TheTastyGreek

[CMJ]

Textbook straw man arguments too

[TheTastyGreek]

Textbook straw man arguments too

It's not about that, really. I get why Rick would be so frustrated with thinking people don't know or respect the history of the school...

But it really isn't relevant in any way in this thread. And bringing up other frustrations here doesn't really accomplish anything for anyone.

[FirefightnRick]

It's not about that, really. I get why Rick would be so frustrated with thinking people don't know or respect the history of the school...

But it really isn't relevant in any way in this thread. And bringing up other frustrations here doesn't really accomplish anything for anyone.

That's not my oppinion in bold. Just keeping with the theme of things around

here, that's all.

And by the way, have I mentioned my browser

at work hates this new website software?

Rick

Edited February 22, 2010 by FirefightnRick

[UNT90]

Rick, for crying out loud... Who here said anything about George being the best anything in any period of our school history?

I'm 100% sure Ronnie Morgan isn't eligible in this discussion.

You're really tilting at windmills here, and nonexistent ones at that.

You know I love you and all, but this is really getting unstable.

I'm thinking it was comedy. Kind of a self parody? At least I hope so.

I think Tramiel is the engine that makes this team go. Only player on the team that demands a double team on the block. Is there a way you can be MVP of your own West division-winning (lets hope) team, yet not be on the All-Conference 1st-3rd team? Maybe a first.

Oh, and I put Josh White a close second to team MVP. His steady hand down the stretch (yes, I said it) has been huge.

[CMJ]

Josh White is my MVP. He might not be the "best" player per se, but without DJ - he's had to run the point with very little rest. He's grown more comfortable in the position, and still hits key buckets when we need them. He's had big steals at the end of games(re: WKU) - and he's our floor leader.

[TheTastyGreek]

That's not my oppinion in bold. Just keeping with the theme of things around

here, that's all.

So if I get upset with 1 or 2 people on the football forum, is it acceptable for me to hijack (remember how much you hate that concept?) every thread on that board?

Maybe I'll just start posting in every single football thread. Every time someone starts talking about the 2010 team, I'll interject and imply or flat out say that everyone is a moron, because Mitch Maher was really good and all anyone is talking about is Riley Dodge.

Anyone want to talk about Todd Dodge's chances of getting to 7 wins? Well, shut the hell up, everyone. Because I think Corky Nelson was better than Dodge. And you're all going to hear it, whether it's relevant or not.

This is the definition of thread hijacking, Rick. You can't get upset at anyone else over humorous or serious thread hijacking if you're going to keep doing stuff like this.

I'm not calling you a bad guy or a bad fan. 3 years ago, the whole reason I met you was because you made the down-and-back drive so you could be there to see JJ and the '07 boys earn the tournament bid. And we celebrated together on the way out to the cars, which we all climbed in to immediately drive back to Dallas.

As I recall, you and Emmitt were on the phone with someone right after that game, talking about another forum member who had been grinding some ridiculous axe all season long.

Again... I'm not trying to insult you here, or anything like that. But I think you're really off base with this stuff.

[FirefightnRick]

Josh White is my MVP. He might not be the "best" player per se, but without DJ - he's had to run the point with very little rest. He's grown more comfortable in the position, and still hits key buckets when we need them. He's had big steals at the end of games(re: WKU) - and he's our floor leader.

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Agree!

Rick

[FirefightnRick]

So if I get upset with 1 or 2 people on the football forum, is it acceptable for me to hijack (remember how much you hate that concept?) every thread on that board?

Maybe I'll just start posting in every single football thread. Every time someone starts talking about the 2010 team, I'll interject and imply or flat out say that everyone is a moron, because Mitch Maher was really good and all anyone is talking about is Riley Dodge.

Anyone want to talk about Todd Dodge's chances of getting to 7 wins? Well, shut the hell up, everyone. Because I think Corky Nelson was better than Dodge. And you're all going to hear it, whether it's relevant or not.

This is the definition of thread hijacking, Rick. You can't get upset at anyone else over humorous or serious thread hijacking if you're going to keep doing stuff like this.

I'm not calling you a bad guy or a bad fan. 3 years ago, the whole reason I met you was because you made the down-and-back drive so you could be there to see JJ and the '07 boys earn the tournament bid. And we celebrated together on the way out to the cars, which we all climbed in to immediately drive back to Dallas.

As I recall, you and Emmitt were on the phone with someone right after that game, talking about another forum member who had been grinding some ridiculous axe all season long.

Again... I'm not trying to insult you here, or anything like that. But I think you're really off base with this stuff.

Hey, I didn't know you saw Mitch play? You have to have seen the person/team play

before you can demean someone from the past and post a Calvinism here. As for hijacking, I first posted an oppinion about George in this thread that applies to

this thread. I think he's every bit a 1st team honoree this year, Thompson and

Josh White as well.

Rick

Edited February 22, 2010 by FirefightnRick

[Quoner]

Hey, I didn't know you saw Mitch play? You have to have seen the person/team play

before you can demean someone from the past and post a Calvinism here. As for hijacking, I first posted an oppinion about George in this thread that applies to

this thread. I think he's every bit a 1st team honoree this year, Thompson and

Josh White as well.

Rick

I think you're going to take this much worse than I intend it, but I have to ask: is this about appreciating the past, appreciating the way you saw the past or just appreciating you? If this is just entrenching into an unpopular side of an opinion just to enjoy some debate, I get that more than most people, but that's not usually how you roll.

We've bantered and gone back and forth quite a few times in the past and always been able to shake hands and laugh in person, but - and it might just be reading your last 4 days of post all at once - you seem like you really have a deeper issue here that we don't know about. You can get frustrated that others may not know their history like you do and see that as devaluing it, but isn't devaluing the present the exact same "sin" reversed? We still get hate mail at the long-defunct TY site over the Hayden Fry article where we applied the methods used to devalue our modern coaches to Fry's record by people who missed the point, so maybe generational satire is just too touchy a subject for any fan base with people more than 15 years apart in age.

I may have to bring a "free hugs" sign to the game Thursday, because we can't be down a fireman once the flaming hot hoops in hot springs commence.

[cwb]

HOT SPRINGS! HUH! MAKE YA SWEAT!

[CaribbeanGreen]

Some independent thoughts w/o jumping into anyone's personal battles:

1) I don't believe you have to have seen someone play to have an opinion on a team, player, or era.

2) They're exactly that - opinions - and we're going to have a lot of differing ones here or in any large group. In stuff like college sports, the toy department of life, no one is ever "right" or "wrong" (quotations copyright KRAM school of journalism) in these things, and even if they could be, it's sure as hell not that important. The fact that we're all here posting on a NT athletics forum alone makes us a rabid minority with more passion about an often insignificant entity than just about anyone else.

3)It seems to me that in most cases, people tend to favor the era they came of age with. Period. This is across the board in any sport, and is the source of many good natured Griffey Jr./Mays, Celtics/Bulls arguments I've had with my dad. In twenty years, those who are in their 20's or so right now will have a greater appreciation for the Johnny Jones (and.. gasp! Darrell Dickey) eras than those who are the students of the future. It's just the way things work, and no one is right or wrong, and no, you can't really compare eras.

Edited February 22, 2010 by CaribbeanGreen

[FirefightnRick]

I think you're going to take this much worse than I intend it, but I have to ask: is this about appreciating the past, appreciating the way you saw the past or just appreciating you? If this is just entrenching into an unpopular side of an opinion just to enjoy some debate, I get that more than most people, but that's not usually how you roll.

That's probably it more than anything.

CaribbeanGreen

3)It seems to me that in most cases, people tend to favor the era they came of age with. Period. This is across the board in any sport, and is the source of many good natured Griffey Jr./Mays, Celtics/Bulls arguments I've had with my dad. In twenty years, those who are in their 20's or so right now will have a greater appreciation for the Johnny Jones (and.. gasp! Darrell Dickey) eras than those who are the students of the future. It's just the way things work, and no one is right or wrong, and no, you can't really compare eras.

Good post and will keep it in mind next time.

Rick