Unt Vs Smu : Attendence

[NorthTexan95]

There been some talk on this board about UNT vs SMU when it came to attendence. I'd thought I'd post the weekly attendence for home games for UNT and for SMU this past season.

UNT

Rice: 23,743

La-La: 17,015

Ark St: 14,589

Fl Int: 14,718

Troy: 14,289

Kan St: 21,952

Total: 106,306

Average: 17,718

SMU

UAB: 16,612

Wash St: 18,184

TCU: 35,481

Tulsa: 19,329

Houston: 20,741

Marshall: 17,513

Total: 127,860

Average: 21,310

So SMU averaged 3,592 more than UNT this past season. However, SMU had one home game with TCU that completely busts the bell curve. If you remove this game their average drops to 18,476 (758 more than us).

In other words, SMU ... with a new stadium ... in a better conference ... playing better "name" home opponents ... with a high profile head coach ... coming off a winning season and bowl victory ... had basically the same number of fans attend their home games as UNT when you remove all the TCU fans who came over from Ft. Worth. I don't need to state all the negatives UNT faced coming into the season and during the season.

Considering all the benefits we have coming into 2011 (new coaching staff, new stadium, better "name" home opponents) I would hope we would see a significant bump in attendance next year and pass SMU. Honestly, I wasn't expecting SMU's attendance to be so low this past season until I looked at the numbers. If we can get things turned around on the field we could race right by SMU very shortly. In a couple of years we could be the team in the area conferences are wanting to have. I'm excited to see just how big this "sleeping giant" really is.

[Green Mean]

UNT Enrollment: About 36K

SMU Enrollment: About 11K

Big difference there.

[NorthTexan95]

UNT Enrollment: About 36K

SMU Enrollment: About 11K

Big difference there.

Big difference ... in our favor.

[Adub4ever]

"UNT has a precident to draw 30k during winning seasons"

we have more fans & students than SMU does... given the right climate at NT, the "sleeping giant" could awaken for the 2011 season.

[KRAM1]

What this shows me is that UNT has a lot of room for positive increases attendance given the size of UNT's student body and alumni base. Right now, as a percentage, SMU is knocking our socks off. Can you imagine what SMU attendance would be in perhaps a different/lesser conference in the eyes of its fan base? Ouch! While UNT's attendance is far below what it probably should be...yes, even now...it does appear that on average increases are being witnessed. I can only imagine what the new stadium, the new coach and new attitude will bring in the way of attendance. Any guesses?

GO MEAN GREEN!

[emmitt01]

UNT Enrollment: About 36K

SMU Enrollment: About 11K

Big difference there.

SMU- Literally in the heart of Dallas (and claims it as a market they're capable of delivering).

That's your big difference. If we're irrelevant to DFW fans they have to travel to tell us.

[Daddy Dumpsalot]

... given the right climate at NT, the "sleeping giant" could awaken for the 2011 season.

I think we have been saying this for 50 years now.

Edited December 18, 2010 by Daddy Dumpsalot

[Texas Stranger]

I think we have been saying this for 50 years now.

"we" ?

[Mean Green Matt]

This proves that as much as SMU would like to think that they are the "Dallas" team, and that the whole city is behind them, they just aren't. They have been successful, exciting coach, nice stadium, etc., and except for a 35,000 against a #4 ranked cross-town rival, they barely averaged more than us. All we need is a little success, and we pass them not just in attendance, but we will start to pull casual Dallas fans up to Denton for games.

I truly believe that if we could combine our success from 2001-2004 with the fanbase that we have today, we would have averaged over 25,000 this season. Now with the new stadium, a great new coach, I can't wait to see us average that or more next year.

[UNT90]

Big difference ... in our favor.

Is it?

25K more students, yet a lower attendance average. It's only an advantage if you take advantage. We haven't.

[SilverEagle]

I think we have been saying this for 50 years now.

I didn't start hearing it until Hayden Fry arrived and his PR people would use that phrase. So 50 years is only a slight exaggeration.

[MeanMag]

Anyone else notice that Bo Levi Mitchell has Eastern Washington (Crazy red field) in the FCS Championship game?

[NorthTexan95]

Is it?

25K more students, yet a lower attendance average. It's only an advantage if you take advantage. We haven't.

It's an advantage because we have a lot of room to grow.

[rcade]

In other words, SMU ... with a new stadium ... in a better conference ... playing better "name" home opponents ... with a high profile head coach ... coming off a winning season and bowl victory ... had basically the same number of fans attend their home games as UNT when you remove all the TCU fans who came over from Ft. Worth.

You're overstating our case a little, but your numbers give me reason for optimism. Our floor for attendance is SMU's ceiling. The new coach and new stadium have to be worth a couple thousand extra butts in seats.

[Green Mean]

It's an advantage because we have a lot of room to grow.

That has been the talk for as long as I could remember. Potential is such an overused and overrated word especially when it comes to college athletics. If SMU continues its upward trend their attendance will rise too and the average college football fan will attend.

You can't just dismiss the size of the school. Both stadiums are the same size practically. It is not out of the possibility that SMU can sell out their stadium in a couple of years.

[KRAM1]

Anyone else notice that Bo Levi Mitchell has Eastern Washington (Crazy red field) in the FCS Championship game?

I did. Good to see a local kid having some success. Now he and his team will get to play in Frisco at Pizza Hut park in the Championship game. Good for him and Eastern washington. BUT, that red field is as ugly as the Boise State blue field.

[NorthTexan95]

You're overstating our case a little, but your numbers give me reason for optimism. Our floor for attendance is SMU's ceiling. The new coach and new stadium have to be worth a couple thousand extra butts in seats.

You're right about me overstating our case. I like to call it "best case scenario". I think the stadium alone is worth a a couple thousand. The new coach ... some big wins ... and you have another few thousand.

[NorthTexan95]

That has been the talk for as long as I could remember. Potential is such an overused and overrated word especially when it comes to college athletics. If SMU continues its upward trend their attendance will rise too and the average college football fan will attend.

You can't just dismiss the size of the school. Both stadiums are the same size practically. It is not out of the possibility that SMU can sell out their stadium in a couple of years.

SMU's upward trend? With all they have going for them they still are averaging about the same as us? I don't see a whole lot of potiential growth for SMU unless they can replicate TCU's on field performance.

[Green Mean]

SMU's upward trend? With all they have going for them they still are averaging about the same as us? I don't see a whole lot of potiential growth for SMU unless they can replicate TCU's on field performance.

You don't see a whole lot of potential growth for SMU because you're wearing UNT glasses. SMU was practically non existent until two years ago. I don't think people realize just how much of their football program was affected by the death penalty and subsequent bad visions from their administration. They are doing things right now. NT is doing stuff right also but you're completely dismissing SMU which is ridiculous.

SMU is less than a third of our size and they still averaged more than us. And in having SMU friends they too have more potential.... they have stated that most students, former alumni don't attend which is a problem we have also. Not to mention it is not out of the possibility that the school size expands...you can have private schools having 20K-25K students.

[dodgefan]

You don't see a whole lot of potential growth for SMU because you're wearing UNT glasses. SMU was practically non existent until two years ago. I don't think people realize just how much of their football program was affected by the death penalty and subsequent bad visions from their administration. They are doing things right now. NT is doing stuff right also but you're completely dismissing SMU which is ridiculous.

SMU is less than a third of our size and they still averaged more than us. And in having SMU friends they too have more potential.... they have stated that most students, former alumni don't attend which is a problem we have also. Not to mention it is not out of the possibility that the school size expands...you can have private schools having 20K-25K students.

SMU's recruiting class is ranked 39th in the nation, very impressive.

[emmitt01]

SMU's recruiting class is ranked 39th in the nation, very impressive.

And I thought nobody used shoe horns anymore.

[UNT90]

SMU's recruiting class is ranked 39th in the nation, very impressive.

Its early. It wont end up that high.

Does anyone think that the stadium being on the other side of the highway from the majority of the campus will hurt student attendance? Also, it has been mentioned that students will not be allowed to park in the dorm parking lot by the AC during game day. Will these things hurt student attendance?

[rcade]

Not to mention it is not out of the possibility that the school size expands...you can have private schools having 20K-25K students.

SMU has around 11,000 students. I'd be amazed if they got anywhere near 20K at what they charge.

[Green Mean]

SMU's recruiting class is ranked 39th in the nation, very impressive.

Wow I didn't know they were ranked that high. Though I believe UNT90 is right in that I don't see it lasting...though they should have a very good class nonetheless.

SMU has around 11,000 students. I'd be amazed if they got anywhere near 20K at what they charge.

I agree that it won't happen quickly...it will take several years to get that high. Keep in mind a lot of students get major scholarships to attend there. And the more exposure SMU gets especially through athletics, the more chance people will want to go there. Schools like USC, BYU, Depaul etc don't have a problem being huge private schools. I have put a link on the largest private universities by enrollment as of the fall 2010 semester. There is no reason why SMU couldn't get up to 20K in say the next 10-15 years if they wanted too.

University Enrollment

[PlummMeanGreen]

Its early. It wont end up that high.

Does anyone think that the stadium being on the other side of the highway from the majority of the campus will hurt student attendance? Also, it has been mentioned that students will not be allowed to park in the dorm parking lot by the AC during game day. Will these things hurt student attendance?

I know I need to do this as much as anyone on GMG.com but...we are finally in a position (with our new stadium) as to where we really don't need to give 2 iotas of mental exercise as to what SMU does with anything. Their "Fill Ford" promo with 17,000 showing up for what they all knew would be a bowl team sorta' lets most of us know where they are with "Dallas" fan support yet.......let them worry more about what UNT is doing from now on like they probably should, right?

In the campus master plan, there is a wide pedestrian bridge (for trolleys, too?) which appears to start close to where the Fout's concession area is. Wonder if some stimulus money would help fund that "bridge to, uh, somewhere?"

Any of you know Congressman Burgess to ask him?

Like OU does from Noble Coliseum with it being so far from Owen Field and thus their trolleys; I think UNT will be creative enough to come up with shuttle buses or trains (like 6 Flags Over Texas has--or used to have).

With all those things working, from East Campus to the new stadium may enable more fans quicker access since most of those trolleys or shuttles will deliver them near the stadium entrances.

When all the pieces of the puzzle are in place with all this, we will have quite a sweet deal going on in Denton with this new stadium. The greenway aspects of all this with all the ponds in play is a quite intriguing feature to me. (And won't all that look quite nice when the ESPN TV cameras pan all of that, too)?

GMG!

Edited December 19, 2010 by PlummMeanGreen