I went outside and the sky was not falling

meangreanmick · September 19, 2005

I couldn't take it anymore. Sorry if this isn't that organized, it is mostly stream of thought.

I was as dissapointed as anyone with the debacle we had. We had pulled about 12 new season ticket holders in this season that we sit with and that wasn't the best start. But when I saw them Sunday, they talked about at least they had fun and we all realize you are going to have good ones and bad ones. A few decided after the game to try and go to the LSU game.

I don't think anyone is satisfied with just winning Sunbelt games, but good grief, why do fans expect we just have the right to win them? We essentially had a death penalty in going to I-AA and we haven't been back for that long in the grand scheme of things. Would you rather have been in SMU's position for the past few years.

Troy won OOC games last year and was very competitive in others. Then they promptly turned around and lost 2 Sunbelt games. And where has that gotten them? Have they suddenly been invited to the Big 12? They struggled mightlily against Missouri this year. Do you think their fans were all that excited about beating Missouri then losing 2 Sunbelt games?

The thing about college football is, players can only play for 4 years. You have good years and bad years. If it were that easy to be good every year, then why is OU struggling so much this year? Why wouldn't UT be like they are this year every year. I was at UT in late 80's - not very good teams.

There is a big difference in wanting something and just expecting something as some kind of birth right. We should all want to be able to win the Sunbelt AND OOC games. Sunbelt has to be first priority (ask Troy). We have to work toward winning more OOC games. That is done by SUPPORTING NT athletics for MANY, MANY years by giving money and showing up for games - win or lose. You can't just say we want to win OOC games and then fire the coach because he hasn't gotten there - unless you provide the LONG TERM support necessary to get there. You can't just say, we won the Sunbelt for a few years, therefore we now have the right to win OOC games. Some players end up being better than expected, some end up being worse, some fail out and some have tragic accidents. Lets keep in mind, 5 years ago, we were freaking bad. We have had a good, short run and the future still looks good. If we keep growing support year after year and in 3 or 4 years we are still having this conversation, then we need to look at how our support is being applied to see if it is still being used in the best way it can.

We are in a better position now than we have been in a very, very long time (probably ever). That is a step forward. You can't measure year to year, you have to measure over longer time periods. We have much better student support and alumni support than ever before. Yes, some will come and go based on short term success but that happens everywhere. But, we have a bigger base of loyal support than we have ever had. That doesn't increase by 50% over night, you have to work to keep increasing in over many years.

Its fine to be be critical and want to be a better program over the long run. Can we ditch the sky is falling routine? How about we act like we belong here in college football? I can see why people from outside NT reading this board would hink Mean Green fans are "idiots" (sorry for bringing that backup). And yes, if we turn the season around AGAIN and win the Sunbelt, I will be very happy. Not satisfied, but happy. Its better than losing the Sunbelt. And I know that we will have a bunch of returning starters next year, unlike this year.

When we played at OU a few years ago, I was riding the bus to the parking lot with obviously mostly OU fans. We were talking with some and a guys was saying how just a few years back they sucked so bad. Knowing that programs are up and down, he took advantage of the fact that many "fans" gave up their season tickets and he bought some season tickets in a much better seating location. Now that they were winning again and more fans had come back, he was reaping the rewards of doing that.

My point overall is this, college football is 2 steps forward and 1 step back for every program, not matter how big. From 5 years ago to now, we have had probably 3 or 4 steps forward in my opinion. As long as over the LONG TERM (4 years is not long term) we are moving forward, we are doing good. There will be some short term 1 step backs. We just have to provide the support needed to keep the 2 step forwards and then we can have the right to expect the 2 step forwards OVER THE LONG TERM.

SilverEagle · September 19, 2005

My point overall is this, college football is 2 steps forward and 1 step back for every program, not matter how big.
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The trouble with that analogy is that most of the "big" programs are about 30 steps ahead of us in the first place. We have to have a "four step forward and one step back" ratio to even get within visual sight of them within the next ten years. We had a great opportunity to take three (or more) steps forward Saturday............

Edited September 19, 2005 by SilverEagle

Harry · September 19, 2005

Wow Mick - solid post. I agree 100%.

I couldn't take it anymore. Sorry if this isn't that organized, it is mostly stream of thought.
I was as dissapointed as anyone with the debacle we had. We had pulled about 12 new season ticket holders in this season that we sit with and that wasn't the best start. But when I saw them Sunday, they talked about at least they had fun and we all realize you are going to have good ones and bad ones. A few decided after the game to try and go to the LSU game.
I don't think anyone is satisfied with just winning Sunbelt games, but good grief, why do fans expect we just have the right to win them? We essentially had a death penalty in going to I-AA and we haven't been back for that long in the grand scheme of things. Would you rather have been in SMU's position for the past few years.
Troy won OOC games last year and was very competitive in others. Then they promptly turned around and lost 2 Sunbelt games. And where has that gotten them? Have they suddenly been invited to the Big 12? They struggled mightlily against Missouri this year. Do you think their fans were all that excited about beating Missouri then losing 2 Sunbelt games?
The thing about college football is, players can only play for 4 years. You have good years and bad years. If it were that easy to be good every year, then why is OU struggling so much this year? Why wouldn't UT be like they are this year every year. I was at UT in late 80's - not very good teams.
There is a big difference in wanting something and just expecting something as some kind of birth right. We should all want to be able to win the Sunbelt AND OOC games. Sunbelt has to be first priority (ask Troy). We have to work toward winning more OOC games. That is done by SUPPORTING NT athletics for MANY, MANY years by giving money and showing up for games - win or lose. You can't just say we want to win OOC games and then fire the coach because he hasn't gotten there - unless you provide the LONG TERM support necessary to get there. You can't just say, we won the Sunbelt for a few years, therefore we now have the right to win OOC games. Some players end up being better than expected, some end up being worse, some fail out and some have tragic accidents. Lets keep in mind, 5 years ago, we were freaking bad. We have had a good, short run and the future still looks good. If we keep growing support year after year and in 3 or 4 years we are still having this conversation, then we need to look at how our support is being applied to see if it is still being used in the best way it can.
We are in a better position now than we have been in a very, very long time (probably ever). That is a step forward. You can't measure year to year, you have to measure over longer time periods. We have much better student support and alumni support than ever before. Yes, some will come and go based on short term success but that happens everywhere. But, we have a bigger base of loyal support than we have ever had. That doesn't increase by 50% over night, you have to work to keep increasing in over many years.
Its fine to be be critical and want to be a better program over the long run. Can we ditch the sky is falling routine? How about we act like we belong here in college football? I can see why people from outside NT reading this board would hink Mean Green fans are "idiots" (sorry for bringing that backup). And yes, if we turn the season around AGAIN and win the Sunbelt, I will be very happy. Not satisfied, but happy. Its better than losing the Sunbelt. And I know that we will have a bunch of returning starters next year, unlike this year.
When we played at OU a few years ago, I was riding the bus to the parking lot with obviously mostly OU fans. We were talking with some and a guys was saying how just a few years back they sucked so bad. Knowing that programs are up and down, he took advantage of the fact that many "fans" gave up their season tickets and he bought some season tickets in a much better seating location. Now that they were winning again and more fans had come back, he was reaping the rewards of doing that.
My point overall is this, college football is 2 steps forward and 1 step back for every program, not matter how big. From 5 years ago to now, we have had probably 3 or 4 steps forward in my opinion. As long as over the LONG TERM (4 years is not long term) we are moving forward, we are doing good. There will be some short term 1 step backs. We just have to provide the support needed to keep the 2 step forwards and then we can have the right to expect the 2 step forwards OVER THE LONG TERM.
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DeepGreen · September 19, 2005

The trouble with that analogy is that most of the "big" programs are about 30 steps ahead of us in the first place. We have to have a "four step forward and one step back" ratio to even get within visual sight of them within the next ten years. We had a great opportunity to take three (or more) steps forward Saturday............

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My sentiments SilverEagle. One would think that after four NO Bowl appearances, including one win, that our recruiting would be such that all we have to do is reload from year to year. To me, the Tulsa game and the soon to be played Louisiana Tech, would be the gauge that we could use to measure where our program was. I'm pretty disappointed at the complete distruction of the Mean Green by a decent Tulsa squad. I know I'm repeating what others have said, but with the nice crowd we had, a win or a more competitive game would have done wonders for us. We failed. No, we failed misurably. I'm pretty disgusted with the thought of possibly not winning any OOC games this year, the winning then possibly conference.

I'll open a can of worms here, but maybe we should have taken the WAC invite. From strictly a football and basketball standpoint, I'm questioning the Sun Belt all over again.

untgirl04 · September 19, 2005

Troy won OOC games last year and was very competitive in others. Then they promptly turned around and lost 2 Sunbelt games. And where has that gotten them? Have they suddenly been invited to the Big 12? They struggled mightlily against Missouri this year. Do you think their fans were all that excited about beating Missouri then losing 2 Sunbelt games?
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For the most part, I agree with what you said, but I disagree about Troy. No, they didn't win the conference, but they ended up at a better bowl game with better payout and TV slot. Where has winning the SBC gotten us? You don't bite the hand that feeds you, and I'm in no way complaining about what we have already accomplished in the SBC. But personally, I would rather win an OCC game or two (or at least play competitively) in them, and drop an SBC game or two to go to a better bowl game. I realize that's taking a chance that some teams may not be as good, but I think the SBC is at least working very hard to get another bowl tie-in. And with the way things are working in the BCS, I forsee some major changes in the future. Although we wouldn't be able to bring as many fans to a bowl game a little farther away, if we can put up good numbers in the game, and even if we don't win, play respectably, we can garner respect in new states. Respect leads to recruits, and although the Texas well is deep, I would love to see North Texas gain recognition on a more national stage.

I realize a lot of this is wishful thinking, and many of you will probably remind me of the "dark" years at North Texas and how we should be thankful that we win games. I know this, and I am thankful, and regardless, I will support my team. But what bothers me is when the kids lose heart. They play for NORTH TEXAS, and win or lose, in my book, that's a damn fine accomplishment.

meangreanmick · September 19, 2005

We laid a dud at precisely the wrong time, no question. But I don't think it is all just poor preparation (although that is clearly part of it). Just becuase it was a great opportunity to take a big step forward, doesn't mean it was possible. What if Tulsa is more talented than we thought or at the very least much more talented than we are? I think we have alot of inexperienced potential on the field that hasn't gotten past potential yet. If it doesn't reach potential and if we aren't recruiting the talent we need, then it is time to start holding people accountable, after they have been given a chance.

OU, OSU, Texas, Penn St. (pick a team) can't just reload from year to year. Why should we be able to every year?

Silver, I agree but I do feel the last 4 years have been the 4 steps forward.

Lets be honest. This all comes down to DD and can he give us some signs over the next year that we are heading in the direction of up over the long run.

untgirl04, I hear you but I would question whether they went to a better bowl. All the way around, I think Troy would have much rather been in our spot.

H-towngreen · September 19, 2005

The only reason Troy went to a bowl was becasue of the end of the seaon fight between South Carolina and Clemson?? Otherwise they would have been at home.

SilverEagle · September 19, 2005

Silver, I agree but I do feel the last 4 years have been the 4 steps forward.
Lets be honest. This all comes down to DD and can he give us some signs over the next year that we are heading in the direction of up over the long run.
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You misunderstand me. I'm saying that we need to take four steps forward (and one back) EVERY year,....not over a four year period.

DD has been here 8 years. If he's going to give us any sort of signs, he would have done it long ago. I'm hoping and praying that last Saturday was not one of them!

Most coaches are fully into their program after three years on the job. After that, the alumni start holding their feet to the fire.

I'd just like to remind everyone that during the "Dark days" of 1-AA that everyone points to when they try to explain why we are so far behind all the other D-1 programs. We had LESS resources and LESS support from the administration, and MORE OCC wins than in the last 8 years.

Come to think of it, the last time we played Tulsa was when we were a 1-AA school. We lost that day (38-20) but we had absolutely NO national rushing leaders on our team, and we had no conference championships under our belt. We did put on a show (single game records that still stand to this day) and we scared the hell out of Tulsa.

stebo · September 19, 2005

Uhh.. Troy did not go to a better bowl game. They had to pay to get in it, got the invite from the SVFC as a last resort (and only after Movie Gallery agreed to sponsor the bowl for a one time gig), lost money on the bowl, and the bowl was so miserably attended that it doesn't even exist now (I also think that re-runs of Moesia had better television ratings than the Silicon Valley Bowl last year).