MGB: Keith Frazier is transferring to UNT, per AAU coach

[Brett Vito]

MGB: Former SMU guard's move to UNT has been in works for some time

http://meangreenblog.dentonrc.com/2016/01/report-keith-frazier-to-unt-is-going-to-happen.html/

Edited January 20, 2016 by Brett Vito

[ChristopherRyanWilkes]

Next year's squad should be the most talented in a while. The question will be if we can get a new coach in time to win with them. 

[Wag Tag]

13 minutes ago, ChristopherRyanWilkes said:

Next year's squad should be the most talented in a while. The question will be if we can get a new coach in time to win with them. 

I think this buys B another year?

[ChristopherRyanWilkes]

Just now, Wag Tag said:

I think this buys B another year?

If he is even a couple games below .500, yes unfortunately. He may force RV's hand like Mac did if we keep losing though. 

[forevereagle]

8 minutes ago, Wag Tag said:

I think this buys B another year?

[BillySee58]

I predict we lose 20 games this year and Benford still returns. And not just because of this.

Also, still no ramifications for RV who is currently 139 games under .500 by his revenue coaches hired in the last 10 years plus our interim.

Edited January 20, 2016 by BillySee58

[Army of Dad]

17 minutes ago, BillySee58 said:

I predict we lose 20 games this year and Benford still returns. And not just because of this.

Also, still no ramifications for RV who is currently 139 games under .500 by his revenue coaches hired in the last 10 years plus our interim.

If Benford is back doesn't it pretty much have to be the result of an extension? It's pretty rare to have a coach working during the last year of his deal...

[forevereagle]

1 minute ago, Army of Dad said:

If Benford is back doesn't it pretty much have to be the result of an extension? It's pretty rare to have a coach working during the last year of his deal...

It is pretty rare, but there is absolutely no way that an extension has been earned.

[JesseMartin]

I really do think there's a good chance that they'll just quietly let his contract run out while they give themselves extra time to find a replacement.  If he doesn't at least win 10 games, they may dump him sooner, but I doubt that will happen.  I have my years right, right?  Next year is the last on his contract?

[Greenrex]

18 minutes ago, BillySee58 said:

I predict we lose 20 games this year and Benford still returns. And not just because of this.

Also, still no ramifications for RV who is currently 139 games under .500 by his revenue coaches hired in the last 10 years plus our interim.

 

North Texas has had various presidents and head coaches across all sports for years but the one constant in this long long nightmare has been its athletic director.

 

[UNT90]

4 hours ago, forevereagle said:

It is pretty rare, but there is absolutely no way that an extension has been earned.

Doesn't mean one won't be given. We are UNT, after all. 

Frazier isn't coming here for Benford. His people know there is a very good chance Benford is gone by March. 

Benford has already screwed over one talented roster, why give him the chance to F another? 

I would say that if Benford is back I won't attend a game at the pit, but it's looking like that won't happen this year, so...

Edited January 20, 2016 by UNT90

[TheTastyGreek]

There's no reasonable way Benford comes back without at least a one year extension, and there's no way we extend him even a year if he finishes another season without a winning record. 

Frazier coming here is great. The right coach could turn this around in a year or two instead of needing three or four.

I'm looking forward to looking forward to basketball again. 

[ChristopherRyanWilkes]

9 minutes ago, TheTastyGreek said:

There's no reasonable way Benford comes back without at least a one year extension, and there's no way we extend him even a year if he finishes another season without a winning record. 

Frazier coming here is great. The right coach could turn this around in a year or two instead of needing three or four.

I'm looking forward to looking forward to basketball again. 

You can see the talent is there already. I really don't equate this to the football situation where there really was very little talent. With even decent coaching this team would be good. 

[GrandGreen]

1 hour ago, TheTastyGreek said:

There's no reasonable way Benford comes back without at least a one year extension, and there's no way we extend him even a year if he finishes another season without a winning record. 

Frazier coming here is great. The right coach could turn this around in a year or two instead of needing three or four.

I'm looking forward to looking forward to basketball again. 

You think he is going to resign if he doesn't get a contract extension?  I highly doubt that, unless there is a buyout involved.  

Strangely, assuming Frazier comes and the others stay this ball club could be good very quickly.   Combs, Reese, Johnson and Frazier are a very good foundation with Brown and Brice with potential.   Whether Benford stays or goes, my guess is that there will be a lot of turnover with the rest of the team.   

[TheTastyGreek]

12 minutes ago, GrandGreen said:

You think he is going to resign if he doesn't get a contract extension?  I highly doubt that, unless there is a buyout involved.  

No, I don't think he'll resign... I'm saying we can't bring him back for a lame duck year, and there's no way to sell an extension for a guy who hasn't gotten above .500 in four years. 

If he doesn't have some sort of miracle run to close out this year that sells an extension of 1-2 years, then he can't realistically coach us next year. 

[greenit]

If the coach doesn't have to recruit new players between the end of the season and the start of next season, does it really matter?  With football it is completely different. 

[greenminer]

1 hour ago, TheTastyGreek said:

No, I don't think he'll resign... I'm saying we can't bring him back for a lame duck year, and there's no way to sell an extension for a guy who hasn't gotten above .500 in four years. 

Can you imagine the napalm kind of postings that would be thrown on this board if RV actually extends him?

There has been a lot of facepalming under RV's watch, and that kind of move would be right near the top of the worst of his moves.

[Army of Dad]

5 hours ago, greenminer said:

Can you imagine the napalm kind of postings that would be thrown on this board if RV actually extends him?

There has been a lot of facepalming under RV's watch, and that kind of move would be right near the top of the worst of his moves.

Five hundred pages of foulness I can't even imagine, or maybe I just don't want to.

 

[UNT90]

8 hours ago, greenit said:

If the coach doesn't have to recruit new players between the end of the season and the start of next season, does it really matter?  With football it is completely different. 

Dude, recruiting is a year round process, especially in basketball. Early signing day is the first week of November. No one is signing with a guy that they may not even play for. 

Silly.

I agree with Tasty that Benford would be gone at any legitimate D1 basketball program. The problem is we aren't that with the current AD, who will always try and justify previous poor decisions. Will the justification reach a point of extending a coach when no other program in America would?

Does anyone really think that isn't a possibility?

Also, will Frazier be a late enrollee this semester? If so, he really doesn't have any options if Benford is fired. And he knows that.

Edited January 21, 2016 by UNT90

[physics90]

10 hours ago, TheTastyGreek said:

No, I don't think he'll resign... I'm saying we can't bring him back for a lame duck year, and there's no way to sell an extension for a guy who hasn't gotten above .500 in four years. 

If he doesn't have some sort of miracle run to close out this year that sells an extension of 1-2 years, then he can't realistically coach us next year. 

What consequences are there if Benford is given an extension no matter what?  Will RV get fired?  Will less people go to games? 

[ChristopherRyanWilkes]

RV has already dropped some strong hints that Benford is on the hot seat. I think RV is a sub-par AD (to say the least) as well, but some on here would say they wouldn't be surprised if he didn't fire McCarney when we lost to Portland State. Benford may force his hand this year, just like McCarney. 

[Army of Dad]

1 hour ago, physics90 said:

What consequences are there if Benford is given an extension no matter what?  Will RV get fired?  Will less people go to games? 

There's already a lot less people going to games. We've kept our season tickets throughout the Benford debacle/era. I don't know that we will do so next year if he is back, it's just not much fun anymore. As evidenced by the fact we are still in our seats, we are pretty die hard, but there's a limit to what we can stomach.

[CMJ]

8 hours ago, Army of Dad said:

Five hundred pages of foulness I can't even imagine, or maybe I just don't want to.

 

Love the Shawshank reference.

[Green P1]

17 hours ago, TheTastyGreek said:

There's no reasonable way Benford comes back without at least a one year extension, and there's no way we extend him even a year if he finishes another season without a winning record. 

Frazier coming here is great. The right coach could turn this around in a year or two instead of needing three or four.

I'm looking forward to looking forward to basketball again. 

I'm looking forward to finally seeing that jumbo screen they hung in the Super Pit...someday. 

[TheTastyGreek]

6 hours ago, physics90 said:

What consequences are there if Benford is given an extension no matter what?  Will RV get fired?  Will less people go to games? 

I think it's more a consequence of personal reputation, and RV's position is going to be what seals it for Benford. 

You can make a lot of claims about why we didn't fire Benford last year or the year before. But one major factor, and it's obvious every time Rick makes a public statement or answers a podcast question about the basketball team, is that RV is desperate for any way to be able to claim Benford ultimately wasn't a failed hire.

The guy has literally deluded himself about the present and the recent past trying to justify not firing Benford already.  Put aside the subjective stuff and just look at the counting numbers... Mistaking how long it took JJ to have a winning season, mistakenly saying we won 18 games under Benford in a tenure where we've never even cracked .500... There was a whole thread (on my phone or I'd link it) I started after a podcast appearance last year where Rick had confused himself just enough to make Benford seem barely palatable. 

Every hire an AD makes is a risk to their own reputation. And Rick's "recent" history (I think @BillySee58 has some figures on hand covering the past decade and a half) is not flattering, so he's been loath to admit the mistake and move on like a real basketball program would. It's personal pride reasons fueling self-delusion or denial. But RV's desperation to see Benford win and salvage his own reputation, which has kept Benford around this long, will also be the end of the line for him. 

Because extending someone with Benford's history or keeping him and spending a year with a losing lame duck coach is so unusual outside of the absolute dregs of D1 sports, it'll make Rick look foolish. Publicly (among anyone bothering to pay attention), and perhaps more importantly... Among his peers. 

Obviously, this is my opinion of how Rick will handle the situation... But, the one positive about our godawful history of coaching hires is that you don't have to look far into the past to find an example of a similar dismal situation. Rick handled the Todd Dodge situation almost exactly the same way, and even that guy didn't get a lame duck year. He got fired as soon as it was obvious he couldn't have a winning season in year 4. Since basketball always has the theoretical possibility of a conference tournament win and an NCAA bid, that's not likely to happen mid-year in basketball. But, when the year is over and the record isn't above .500, I'm convinced it's finally going to be the end.