Unt Lands Another Recruit

[TIgreen01]

Yes, but remember, the hiring of Dodge was supposed to make us competitive for known players. It hasn't.

Look, there's no way around it. The top players in the area are not considering us. It isn't difficult to understand. Just look at any list. Dallas Morning News, Rivals, Scout...the vast majority of OLs and DLs are gone. Less than a handful even considered us,

It was all part of the big lie - Dodge would have talent flocking to Denton on his name alone. It hasn't happened. Kids don't care. They want to win. We don't win. They can see Dodge isn't changing anything. So, they're not jumping aboard. We've already been beaten locally and statewide for the best, and we're not even ten days into December.

And, yes, the committment of the player from Glen Rose is what we used to deride as "stealth recruiting." The truth is, we haven't improved any in recruiting. We're, at minimum, right back where we were with Dickey or worse. We're scraping the JUCOs, like Dickey used to do, and garnering committments from guys few people have heard of...like Dickey used to do. It eventually worked with Dickey because he had assistants who knew the college game and could develop them. We now lack that even that element.

Why don't we wait until after signing day to rip Dodge for this upcoming class?? We have rarely gotten any top lineman off the area and state lists---but neither do TCU/SMU/Baylor/UTEP/Houston and they are at least 1-2 rungs up on us conference wise. You MIGHT see those schools land 1 per year, 2 if they're lucky. I'm not sure why you had expectations that we'd suddenly start landing highly rated linemen when not even the best of the non-BCS, in this state, rarely do.

I'm not trying to make excuses for Dodge, but you have to be realistic. You sound like you just sit around looking for reasons to attack our coaching staff. If you had realistic expectations about "who" Dodge was likely to up our stock with (ie---skill players, duh), he has done that in spades. We are going to have to continue to do what we've always done, at this school, and be good evaluators of linemen prospects and have some of those guys pay off. Hiring Dodge was never going to be the magic pill to suddenly start stealing lineman from the BCS schools....that is going to take time to develop a history of producing good lines and then sending guys on to the NFL---something we haven't done since the early 70's?

[The Fake Lonnie Finch]

Why don't we wait until after signing day to rip Dodge for this upcoming class?? We have rarely gotten any top lineman off the area and state lists---but neither do TCU/SMU/Baylor/UTEP/Houston and they are at least 1-2 rungs up on us conference wise. You MIGHT see those schools land 1 per year, 2 if they're lucky. I'm not sure why you had expectations that we'd suddenly start landing highly rated linemen when not even the best of the non-BCS, in this state, rarely do.

I'm not trying to make excuses for Dodge, but you have to be realistic. You sound like you just sit around looking for reasons to attack our coaching staff. If you had realistic expectations about "who" Dodge was likely to up our stock with (ie---skill players, duh), he has done that in spades. We are going to have to continue to do what we've always done, at this school, and be good evaluators of linemen prospects and have some of those guys pay off. Hiring Dodge was never going to be the magic pill to suddenly start stealing lineman from the BCS schools....that is going to take time to develop a history of producing good lines and then sending guys on to the NFL---something we haven't done since the early 70's?

They're all gotten linemen off the top lists. And, Dodge was supposed to bring us to that level. He hasn't. My expectations are that in the third recruiting year for a coach, that he's competitive in his area. Dodge isn't.

No one is even talking about stealing from BCS school. SMU and Baylor are nabbing OLs and DLs from the state and area top lists. We are not. They run similar offenses. It's a problem. They're not having to scrape around JUCOs either. We are. Even after two classes signed by Dodge. It's a problem.

You can go back to the Dodge hiring thread to show the expectation level that was built for recruiting with his hire. I'm sorry that you and others refuse to acknowledge that we've been beaten worse this year than in his prior two football recruiting periods. As of now, we are getting the scraps. The area and state guys are gone. It will cause a gap for whoever the new coach turns out to be next November or December.

Edited December 8, 2008 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

[TIgreen01]

They're all gotten linemen off the top lists. And, Dodge was supposed to bring us to that level. He hasn't. My expectations are that in the third recruiting year for a coach, that he's competitive in his area. Dodge isn't.

No one is even talking about stealing from BCS school. SMU and Baylor are nabbing OLs and DLs from the state and area top lists. We are not. They run similar offenses. It's a problem. They're not having to scrape around JUCOs either. We are. Even after two classes signed by Dodge. It's a problem.

You can go back to the Dodge hiring thread to show the expectation level that was built for recruiting with his hire. I'm sorry that you and others refuse to acknowledge that we've been beaten worse this year than in his prior two football recruiting periods. As of now, we are getting the scraps. The area and state guys are gone. It will cause a gap for whoever the new coach turns out to be next November or December.

Refusing to acknowledge that the recruiting class that has yet to sign is worse than the previous two?? Come on, man. Have some patience and wait until Feb. to see what transpires. We still have almost 2 full months to go.

SMU has got 2 commits from the DFW area 100 list, Baylor 1, maybe 2? You have to be kidding if you think that's just leaps and bounds ahead of us. It's one or two players and in any given year we might get lucky and get the same. I have no idea how those schools do in Houston/SA/Austin, but I imagine that DFW is their main point of emphasis. From what I can tell (attempting to follow OT's recruiting updates) Dodge and staff are going for immediate commits from top (JUCO) guys, but still courting quite a few players. I think that as things start getting closer to the deadline, commits can change and the schools around us are going to start juggling guys as well.....I still think we're going to be fine in Feb. We have something that no other school in the state can offer in quite the same capacity---IMMEDIATE playing time as evidenced by our terrible defenses of the last 2 years.

If you're just ticked b/c we're not out there landing top 100 guys in our early commits, I don't know what to tell you other than what I said in my first post. I think UNT's season results have a lot to do with that as well as the shape of Fouts. If we turn dirt on the stadium by this summer, then I'd expect to see us land a couple big studs next recruiting season (though it could be by a new coaching staff if Dodge comes out of the gate in 09 like we did in 08).

[Mean Green 93-98]

[brock Wempa] has shown interest before the season even started and NO we have yet to offer. Never offered Huber from Nederland either who had interest as well. Baylor offered and he gave a verbal. I guess he wasn't good enough for us ?? You would think that after losing our top recruit , Flaxx , we would of offered this kid already

"It's down to UTEP and Iowa State and I'm definitely leaning toward Iowa State," said Wempa.

http://northtexas.scout.com/a.z?s=353&p=2&c=819270

[untgeorge]

SMU has got 2 commits from the DFW area 100 list, Baylor 1, maybe 2?

Actually SMU has 5.

[Green Dozer]

How many No. 1 draft picks in the NFL have gone bust? Look, those lists are great, but Mel Kiper has missed on more players than he got right. I can't believe that you, Lonnie, think we can compete with SMU and Baylor with the TOP 150 recruits. Some in the top 200 and toward the bottom (between #150 and #200), yes. But if these guys attend a game, even in Dickey's day, and they're not picking here, sorry. Unless you read the signs in the end zone in the 4th year after 3 championships, you wouldn't know that this program was a 3 time champion by the crowd and the facilities. We are not competing as for as facilities and other little perks. It comes down to the details and the dollars.

[Green Dozer]

The truth is, unless you are riding shotgun with Dodge or any of the others coaches, you don't have a clue who, where or what position he is recruiting. Truth is, none of us will know what this class will look like until National Signing Day. Truth is, whoever the class contains, TFLF will bad mouth Dodge for not signing someone. Truth is, this is not "stealth recruiting." Stealth recruiting was DD recruiting a kid, getting his committment and then telling the young man to not say a word to anyone about it. Stealth recruiting was not having a clue until signing day who NT would sign. That is what stealth recruiting is. Truth is, our last two recruiting classes have been rated higher than any of Dickey's, and we don't have any idea who all will end up in this class until their name is signed on the dotted line the first week of February, so stating "We're, at a minimum, right back where we were with Dickey or worse" is a ridiculous comment. Truth is, TFLF will change the arguement to fit his agenda when someone posts facts to refute his claims.

Back to the true intention of this thread:

Welcome to North Texas Derek. I wish you nothing but the best the next four or five years.

Lifer,

Good points. Derek may read this thread and wonder just what he has gotten himself into.

[Mean Green 93-98]

How many No. 1 draft picks in the NFL have gone bust? Look, those lists are great, but Mel Kiper has missed on more players than he got right. I can't believe that you, Lonnie, think we can compete with SMU and Baylor with the TOP 150 recruits. Some in the top 200 and toward the bottom (between #150 and #200), yes. But if these guys attend a game, even in Dickey's day, and they're not picking here, sorry. Unless you read the signs in the end zone in the 4th year after 3 championships, you wouldn't know that this program was a 3 time champion by the crowd and the facilities. We are not competing as for as facilities and other little perks. It comes down to the details and the dollars.

We certainly competed with SMU last year. If we had gone 10-2 this year, we'd be blowing them out of the water right now.

I'm not one of those calling for Dodge's head, but our record is really going to hurt our recruiting.

[bigntex]

I would think this would be a tough position to recruit with the son having four years left. Derek might be like one of those kids who thinks D-1 or nothing. Who would want to sit behind Riley for four seasons and have one year to play?

Dodge is gonna have trouble this year and next getting quality QB's to commit. Not until Riley is a Junior will UNT get a top QB prospect with multiple D-1 offers.

Still believe that Dodge gets another QB to at least grey shirt.

[The Fake Lonnie Finch]

It's really remarkable that we're not supposed to demand that we compete with even the lower rung schools in our area - SMU and Baylor. It's incredibly sad that we set the bar so low that when Baylor and SMU start to wipe us away in area recruiting that all of the sudden we're not supposed to be comparing ourselves to them.

Well, campers, here's the picture: they run the same offense we do, so they'll be recruiting the same players we should be recruiting. If we are not competitive with even the like of SMU and Baylor then we are seriously in trouble.

It's bad enough to not be able to compete for the elite players. But, to get wiped out by a school 45 minutes away with an identical 1-11 record in SMU...and Baylor, about an hour and a half away, going through their umpteenth losing season in a row...is inexcusable for a coach and coaching staff entering their third year of recruiting.

Currently, we are landing kids with only offers from the likes of Texas State, Eastern New Mexico, and Sam Houston State. Is that who we're supposed to be competing against? Is that the standard? Is that why Todd Dodge was hired, so that in year three he'd be recruiting against the I-AA/FBS schools of the region?

Edited December 9, 2008 by The Fake Lonnie Finch

[NT03]

It's really remarkable that we're not supposed to demand that we compete with even the lower rung schools in our area - SMU and Baylor. It's incredibly sad that we set the bar so low that when Baylor and SMU start to wipe us away in area recruiting that all of the sudden we're not supposed to be comparing ourselves to them.

Well, campers, here's the picture: they run the same offense we do, so they'll be recruiting the same players we should be recruiting. If we are not competitive with even the like of SMU and Baylor then we are seriously in trouble.

It's bad enough to not be able to compete for the elite players. But, to get wiped out by a school 45 minutes away with an identical 1-11 record in SMU...and Baylor, about an hour and a half away, going through their umpteenth losing season in a row...is inexcusable for a coach and coaching staff entering their third year of recruiting.

Currently, we are landing kids with only offers from the likes of Texas State, Eastern New Mexico, and Sam Houston State. Is that who we're supposed to be competing against? Is that the standard? Is that why Todd Dodge was hired, so that in year three he'd be recruiting against the I-AA/FBS schools of the region?

We are not really recruiting against Baylor since we won't give an offer to the kids that might actually want to come here , whereas Baylor does.

Last year Ben Parks wanted to come to UNT , but only had an offer from Wyoming and gave a verbal to them after holding out for one closer to home. Then Baylor came a calling and he switched where he was the Bears starting PK this year as a true freshman. Vito did a story on him and he indeed was interested in UNT.

Earlier this year Mr Mosley said that OL Stephen Huber was interested in joining his former HS classmate to Denton. From what I understand , we never offered and missed out.

Edited December 10, 2008 by NT03

[TIgreen01]

Actually SMU has 5.

I was talking about linemen.....SMU has 2. Overall they may have 5, but we have 2....so far.

[TIgreen01]

It's really remarkable that we're not supposed to demand that we compete with even the lower rung schools in our area - SMU and Baylor. It's incredibly sad that we set the bar so low that when Baylor and SMU start to wipe us away in area recruiting that all of the sudden we're not supposed to be comparing ourselves to them.

Well, campers, here's the picture: they run the same offense we do, so they'll be recruiting the same players we should be recruiting. If we are not competitive with even the like of SMU and Baylor then we are seriously in trouble.

It's bad enough to not be able to compete for the elite players. But, to get wiped out by a school 45 minutes away with an identical 1-11 record in SMU...and Baylor, about an hour and a half away, going through their umpteenth losing season in a row...is inexcusable for a coach and coaching staff entering their third year of recruiting.

Currently, we are landing kids with only offers from the likes of Texas State, Eastern New Mexico, and Sam Houston State. Is that who we're supposed to be competing against? Is that the standard? Is that why Todd Dodge was hired, so that in year three he'd be recruiting against the I-AA/FBS schools of the region?

When did anyone say that we're not even competing with them?? This year, SMU has 2 oline players ranked in the area 100 that have orally committed. Last year we had 1 (Troy Franklin). As far as overall recruiting we still have landed more area 100 kids in the last 2-3 years than they have (or if not, very close to a tie).

You've been going nuts in this thread claiming that our staff cannot recruit, but over the last 2 years they have done better than every mid-major in this state other than maybe TCU. You want to be able to continue along with your fire and brimstone rhetoric, but it makes no sense to criticize this upcoming recruiting class when not a single player has put pen to paper and signed for any school. Wait until after Feb., and if this class turns out to be a turd, then by all means open up the criticism.

[UNTflyer]

Some people thought the cupboard was bear when Dodge took over; just wait until he leaves.

[greenminer]

Don't kid yourselves with rankings and stars.

Dodge is bringing in 20 more 3 star wideouts that will have our recruit average ranked higher than anybody in the state. Unfortunately, those rankings don't factor in the fact that he is not bringing in crops of lineman to compliment the skill positions.

We're going to be Skill Position All-Star U when he's done, and they're all going to be running for their lives on their way to more 1-win seasons.

[Green Dozer]

We certainly competed with SMU last year. If we had gone 10-2 this year, we'd be blowing them out of the water right now.

I'm not one of those calling for Dodge's head, but our record is really going to hurt our recruiting.

Maybe, but also we might attract a kid who does not think he got his share of stars or mentioned on lists that thinks he can come here and play pretty quick, prove the doubters wrong. There are lots of studs from high school that become duds in college. (Quoner or Tasty might be able to explain that better). And no, for the real top recruits, we are not going to blow anybody out of the water. We had 4 conference championships in a row, and that did not matter much in our recruiting did it?

The Mel Kipers are more wrong on players than right. As miner says, don't put to much into the stars.

Edited December 9, 2008 by Green Dozer

[Quoner]

Maybe, but also we might attract a kid who does not think he got his share of stars or mentioned on lists that thinks he can come here and play pretty quick, prove the doubters wrong. There are lots of studs from high school that become duds in college. (Quoner or Tasty might be able to explain that better). And no, for the real top recruits, we are not going to blow anybody out of the water. We had 4 conference championships in a row, and that did not matter much in our recruiting did it?

The Mel Kipers are more wrong on players than right. As miner says, don't put to much into the stars.

Yes- this quiz might shed some light on how some people peak early and never sustain success: http://www.selectsmart.com/FREE/select.php...nt=80schildstar

[Green Lantern]

But...we've still got reach for the stars, right? Never give up hope.

[mad dog]

AHA!!! Maybe that's the reason... There was a bear in the cupboard, and ate all the blue-chip talent.

Which begs the question: if a grizzly bear wanted to transfer from Alaska, and, assuming he had the grades, would you burn a 'ship for him?

[DeepGreen]

Which begs the question: if a grizzly bear wanted to transfer from Alaska, and, assuming he had the grades, would you burn a 'ship for him?

Pay the man Shirley.

[FirefightnRick]

Pay the man Shirley.

Don't you dare call me Surely!

Crap, now I'm doing it also.

Rick