Not a post to stir up the masses...

[BIG DAWG]

I recently read on one of the posts that someone has heard Dan Meager was having "a great" summer, and he would be surprised if he wasn't the starter this summer.

Here is my question to all of you, NOT A "WHO'S YOUR FAVORITE", but...

1) Can Dan Meager win the job after bringing in Wilson, and the Spring Game Phillips had?

and...

2) Is there any way you can see us only going with one guy?

I fear more than anything what I see as the curse of playing two QB's. I know there are a FEW times it has worked, but I really think it sucks most times coaches try to use this philosophy/gameplan.

Remeber, try not hi-jack this thread with who you think is better, and all of that. That is a topic better suited for FALL BALL. Just simply answer the 2 simple questions if at all posible.

[mad dog]

man... that's such a horribly constraining rule. I can't just say "yes" or "no." It isn't a yes or no situation.

1) Daniel Meager can win, but he's going to have to come out with confidence that I haven't seen from him since his freshman year. If he returns to that guy I saw in the fall of 2004, he'll open some eyes. Phillips is the number 1, from where I sit. I didn't feel like Wilson substantially distanced himself from Meager in Spring Ball.

2) Coach Dickey seems to be very much a one quarterback type guy. Case in point: see how long Meager stayed in even when he struggled? Except in case of injury, I don't think we'll see much of a rotation. The guy Coach feels comfortable with in August will likely be starting in November, barring injury.

[BIG DAWG]

That post was more than fit any constaints I placed on the thread.

I just didn't want this to turn into a QB controversy thread before practice evan began.

What you posted was exactly the angle I was shooting for

[adman]

man... that's such a horribly constraining rule.  I can't just say "yes" or "no."  It isn't a yes or no situation.

1) Daniel Meager can win, but he's going to have to come out with confidence that I haven't seen from him since his freshman year.  If he returns to that guy I saw in the fall of 2004, he'll open some eyes.  Phillips is the number 1, from where I sit.  I didn't feel like Wilson substantially distanced himself from Meager in Spring Ball.

2) Coach Dickey seems to be very much a one quarterback type guy.  Case in point: see how long Meager stayed in even when he struggled?  Except in case of injury, I don't think we'll see much of a rotation.  The guy Coach feels comfortable with in August will likely be starting in November, barring injury.

←

As to point one, which, sorry Big Dawg, will rely on conjecture. Do you think Wilson didn't distance himself largely based on lack of reps in the system as opposed to Meager's year? And given Summer practice do you think he'll have enough reps to go along with athletic ability to beat out Meager?

[SilverEagle]

To answer your questions.

A. Yes

B. If the answer to "A" is yes, then the answer to "B" is also yes.

There! Does this adequately meet your needs BD?

[mad dog]

As to point one, which, sorry Big Dawg, will rely on conjecture.  Do you think Wilson didn't distance himself largely based on lack of reps in the system as opposed to Meager's year?  And given Summer practice do you think he'll have enough reps to go along with athletic ability to beat out Meager?

←

In regards to your first question, I believe that is about half of it. The other half is that neither made a move that would put them above Phillips. So while Wilson had his moments where he looked better than Meager, he also has tendencies that hurt him, and the bottom line is neither Wilson or Meager is seems to be ahead of Phillips at this point.

[BIG DAWG]

My whole view is that most seem to be pulling/leaning towards Meager or Wilson, myself included, I seem to always pull for Meager, but Phillips just seems to always be the guy that gets things done. The guy who is always there but never gets credit as THE GUY.

Always has been odd to me since Hall left.

[Mad Hatter]

Give me Wilson and a more open offense.......yeah right. I love the fact that the guy can run, and complete some passes, but I don't see Dickey moving to that style of game. So it'll probably be Phillips or Meager.

[buff64]

Seems to me that Phillips has shown a lot of the same qualities that Scott Hall pocessed. Adequate arm, good feet ( was an outstanding runner in HS ) and most importantly , a competive fire. Don't know about leadership skills, that will have to be determined by others.

That said I'm not sure we have seen a healthy Meager yet , and Wilson was new to the system this spring. Can Wilson fit in with our offensive system ?

[emmitt01]

Seems to me that Phillips has shown a lot of the same qualities that Scott Hall pocessed. Adequate arm, good feet ( was an outstanding runner in HS ) and most importantly , a competive fire. Don't know about leadership skills, that will have to be determined by others.

That said I'm not sure we have seen a healthy Meager yet , and Wilson was new to the system this spring. Can Wilson fit in with our offensive system ?

←

I think we may be missing the most important point of all. Wilson may be our best option by necessity. Regardless of his grasp of the system, arm strength, etc he may the only guy athletic enough to run for his life and make something out of nothing. If our O-Line is sub par (a real possibility) you can have all the wide open receivers you want, the QB will be too busy trying to keep his head on his shoulders.

[SilverEagle]

I think we may be missing the most important point of all.  Wilson may be our best option by necessity.  Regardless of his grasp of the system, arm strength, etc he may the only guy athletic enough to run for his life and make something out of nothing. If our O-Line is sub par (a real possibility) you can have all the wide open receivers you want, the QB will be too busy trying to keep his head on his shoulders.

←

Then we need to make Johnny Quinn our QB........

[TIgreen01]

man... that's such a horribly constraining rule.  I can't just say "yes" or "no."  It isn't a yes or no situation.

1) Daniel Meager can win, but he's going to have to come out with confidence that I haven't seen from him since his freshman year.  If he returns to that guy I saw in the fall of 2004, he'll open some eyes.  Phillips is the number 1, from where I sit.  I didn't feel like Wilson substantially distanced himself from Meager in Spring Ball.

←

So, any idea where that fits with Dickey's thoughts? From what I saw of Phillips last year, in one scrimmage in the spring, and the Spring green/white game...Phillips isn't that far ahead--if at all. Everyone always points to his 'great' spring game as what separated him, but I have to wonder how well W. Wilson would have done if you kept the same teams, but switched the QBs---so Wilson would have had the oline and Phillips would have been running from Ike Thomas all night. Don't underestimate the impact that Ike Thomas had on that spring game...he DOMINATED it.

So while Wilson had his moments where he looked better than Meager, he also has tendencies that hurt him, and the bottom line is neither Wilson or Meager is seems to be ahead of Phillips at this point.

←

...and so does Phillips....particularly his feel for pressure in the pocket, tendency to hold the ball too long and then force it into bad spots. To me, and knowing what kind of QBs Dickey has played in his 8 seasons here (going back to Attaway and Richard Bridges), Phillips possesses the #1 quality that would land him last on DD's list---his tendency to turn the ball over.

So, to answer Big Dawg's question...I think it's still a 3-way battle. Anyone can come out on top.

Edited June 14, 2006 by TIgreen01

[medpilot21]

Question 1: Meager could win the job back, but he would have to have a stellar August, and Phillips would have to struggle. Coach Dickey likes DM because he gives everything he has and never quits. Considerring his shoulder injuries, Danny has really played through the pain. It's unfortunate but often being a warrior is not enough to win at this level. I wouldnt rule Meager out, but I would consider him a long-shot to start.

Question #2: We will go with one guy if ONE guy steps up and takes the reins on this team. We dont know enough about Woody yet to know about his leadership ability, but Phillips takes charge when he is in there. Some of the comments we overheard (during spring practice) were about how much Phillips has taken over as a team leader. He apparently has built a lot of confidence with the receiving corps. I dont know what kind of edge that gives him, but he would be that ONE guy we are looking for if he continues to progress.

Final note: Not to throw a wrench in this discussion, but dont forget we now have Steve Prince in the mix also. This guy is a born leader and was J-Mo's QB at Longview Springhill. He has a cannon for an arm and reads the field well. I think we red-shirt him this season, but the kid is something special. He has that arrogant attitude that makes his team mates believe they can always win. Next year could be very interesting in the QB competition. As for this year, that discussion comes in Fall Ball.

GMG!!!

[SilverEagle]

Question 1: Meager could win the job back, but he would have to have a stellar August, and Phillips would have to struggle. Coach Dickey likes DM because he gives everything he has and never quits.  Considerring his shoulder injuries, Danny has really played through the pain. It's unfortunate but often being a warrior is not enough to win at this level. I wouldnt rule Meager out, but I would consider him a long-shot to start.

Question #2:  We will go with one guy if ONE guy steps up and takes the reins on this team. We dont know enough about Woody yet to know about his leadership ability, but Phillips takes charge when he is in there. Some of the comments we overheard (during spring practice) were about how much Phillips has taken over as a team leader. He apparently has built a lot of confidence with the receiving corps. I dont know what kind of edge that gives him, but he would be that ONE guy we are looking for if he continues to progress.

Final note: Not to throw a wrench in this discussion, but dont forget we now have Steve Prince in the mix also. This guy is a born leader and was J-Mo's QB at Longview Springhill. He has a cannon for an arm and reads the field well. I think we red-shirt him this season, but the kid is something special. He has that arrogant attitude that makes his team mates believe they can always win. Next year could be very interesting in the QB competition. As for this year, that discussion comes in Fall Ball.

GMG!!!

←

That's a lot of stuff to see in a player considering that he sat out most of the spring practice. Are you just trying to yank someone's chain?

[pollock]

Then we need to make Johnny Quinn our QB........

←

Johnny Quinn can't be QB because his grip strength would make the ball explode.

If the ball didn't explode and, God forbid, he actually threw it, there would be massive environmental impact due to the hole it would create in the ozone layer as it left the atmosphere.

[SilverEagle]

Johnny Quinn can't be QB because his grip strength would make the ball explode. 

If the ball didn't explode and, God forbid, he actually threw it, there would be massive environmental impact due to the hole it would create in the ozone layer as it left the atmosphere.

←

OHMYGOD! It's a Bill Brasky highjack.

[FirefightnRick]

Yes, and yes. It will be Meager under center this season.

Rick

[medpilot21]

That's a lot of stuff to see in a player considering that he sat out most of the spring practice.  Are you just trying to yank someone's chain?

←

Actually..I think he sat out the entire spring didnt he? No chain-yanking intended. Steve Prince was a fantastic QB in high school. I was talking about his potential. I talked with him a couple of times during the spring, and the attitude J-Mo was referring to is certainly there. Who ever really knows what will happen when these guys get to the college level, but we can always tell when there is something different about a player. As far as leadership goes, he was on the sidelines barking at the guys on field to watch for coverages and shifts. No other player we stood next to did that? I didnt even hear a player on the field do that? Prince was also talking to the players and coaches about reads, even when some of the QB's out there practicing werent paying as much attention. I got the feeling this guy was different. He is VERY vocal and stood out, even while injured.

It's true we dont really know anything other than what he did at LongView. But if what I have seen so far means anything, he could be a difference maker.

Here's hoping...

GMG!!!

[mad dog]

So, any idea where that fits with Dickey's thoughts?  From what I saw of Phillips last year, in one scrimmage in the spring, and the Spring green/white game...Phillips isn't that far ahead--if at all.  Everyone always points to his 'great' spring game as what separated him, but I have to wonder how well W. Wilson would have done if you kept the same teams, but switched the QBs---so Wilson would have had the oline and Phillips would have been running from Ike Thomas all night.  Don't underestimate the impact that Ike Thomas had on that spring game...he DOMINATED it.

←

Iono what coach dickey will think. If I had to guess, he's taking a wait-and-see approach. For now, at least, given what I saw all through last year's two a days, through the season, through spring ball, and, yes, the spring game, too, Phillips is the guy. He is the best quarterback on the roster.

I don't want to dismiss the athletic ability of Meager or Wilson, but I do think people tend to overrate Wilson's running ability. I'm sure that is a great bonus, but he won't ever see the field if he can't make good decisions WHEN he runs with it. His tendency to run up the middle of the field will get him killed against a strong defense, and he put the ball on the ground a few times when he did run with it. He'll need to be a Quarterback, too. Otherwise, like someone else jokingly said, we might as well put Johnny Quinn under center. Until he shows he is a better QB than Phillips, I can't see him starting.

...and so does Phillips....particularly his feel for pressure in the pocket, tendency to hold the ball too long and then force it into bad spots.  To me, and knowing what kind of QBs Dickey has played in his 8 seasons here (going back to Attaway and Richard Bridges), Phillips possesses the #1 quality that would land him last on DD's list---his tendency to turn the ball over. 

In terms of who we have on the roster, what I have seen in practice and in game-type situations, Phillips is the best option we have. If you want to point to his 5 INTs last year, you can do the same, but remember that he was throwing downfield in losing efforts trying to get his team back into the game for the two in the Lousiana tech game, and one of them was off a Wide Reciever tipping the ball up in the air. To go with this, of course, he had as many touchdowns as the guy who played for most of the season. Turning the ball over? Even if you want to make that case, Wilson threw more interceptions this spring in practice, and fumbled at least three times taking off with the ball. Meager threw fewer picks than Wilson, but didn't have as much upside in terms of speed or touchdowns through the air.

Phillips did hang on to the ball a little longer than he should have last season, but, again, you have to look at the situation. When you are trying to get your guys back into a game, and you are thrown in cold in the middle of the fourth quarter, you are going to make mistakes that you might not if the whole game was yours to command. He's gotten a little better at dumping off the ball during the spring, but he is going to have to continue to get better. There, you are right on.

Bottom line, if someone shows up and plays well, they are going to start. While Phillips is in the lead at this point, it isn't anything CLOSE to a done deal.

[TIgreen01]

Iono what coach dickey will think.  If I had to guess, he's taking a wait-and-see approach.  For now, at least, given what I saw all through last year's two a days, through the season, through spring ball, and, yes, the spring game, too, Phillips is the guy.  He is the best quarterback on the roster.

I don't want to dismiss the athletic ability of Meager or Wilson, but I do think people tend to overrate Wilson's running ability.  I'm sure that is a great bonus, but he won't ever see the field if he can't make good decisions WHEN he runs with it.  His tendency to run up the middle of the field will get him killed against a strong defense, and he put the ball on the ground a few times when he did run with it.  He'll need to be a Quarterback, too.  Otherwise, like someone else jokingly said, we might as well put Johnny Quinn under center.  Until he shows he is a better QB than Phillips, I can't see him starting.

In terms of who we have on the roster, what I have seen in practice and in game-type situations, Phillips is the best option we have.  If you want to point to his 5 INTs last year, you can do the same, but remember that he was throwing downfield in losing efforts trying to get his team back into the game for the two in the Lousiana tech game, and one of them was off a Wide Reciever tipping the ball up in the air.  To go with this, of course, he had as many touchdowns as the guy who played for most of the season.  Turning the ball over?  Even if you want to make that case, Wilson threw more interceptions this spring in practice, and fumbled at least three times taking off with the ball.  Meager threw fewer picks than Wilson, but didn't have as much upside in terms of speed or touchdowns through the air.

Phillips did hang on to the ball a little longer than he should have last season, but, again, you have to look at the situation.  When you are trying to get your guys back into a game, and you are thrown in cold in the middle of the fourth quarter, you are going to make mistakes that you might not if the whole game was yours to command.  He's gotten a little better at dumping off the ball during the spring, but he is going to have to continue to get better.  There, you are right on.

Bottom line, if someone shows up and plays well, they are going to start.  While Phillips is in the lead at this point, it isn't anything CLOSE to a done deal.

←

Good reply. So, I would be interested to hear a breakdown of each player...from arm strength, making reads, play making ability, leadership, etc, etc...then ranking each against each other. I know what I've seen in my limited (mostly game--spring or regular season) exposure to them compared to what you have seen plus whatever you've heard from being an insider...

[mad dog]

that'll be up for the general board here sometime in july. To get ready for the season, Harry and I are going to do a position by position breakdown. We'll highlight one position every few days. Nothing really earth shattering, just so everyone can get caught up for the season, so it'll be general forum type stuff.

If you have a more specific question, I'd be more than happy to go into that here.