Coker/utsa Article On Rivals Front Page

[gangrene]

National Notes: Coker back on recruiting trail

Coker is building the program from scratch and just recently hired his first three assistants. He's also going to hold the school's first football camp June 18-20. Later, the school is going to break ground on its stadium.

UTSA will sign its first recruiting class in February and is scheduled to compete as a Football Championship Subdivision (i.e., Division I-AA) member beginning in 2011. From there, UTSA's goal is to eventually become part of Conference USA.

Johnson's commitment was a nice recruiting victory for Coker. The 5-foot-9, 182-pound Johnson – who has rushed for more than 3,200 yards and 34 touchdowns the past two seasons – also had scholarship offers from Colorado and Iowa State.

Ok, I'm going to be honest. This does make me a little nervous if for no other reason than the fact it creates more direct competition for UNT for FBS talent in the state of Texas. Don't they also already have a higher, per hour, dedicated athletic fee than we do?

[The Fake Lonnie Finch]

"UTSA will sign its first recruiting class in February and is scheduled to compete as a Football Championship Subdivision (i.e., Division I-AA) member beginning in 2011. From there, UTSA's goal is to eventually become part of Conference USA.

They will do it, too. And, we will be watching it all go down from the Sun Belt.

[Chrisattsu]

UTSA shouldn't surprise anyone. Once AD Hickey got the ball rolling, it was only a matter of time before the recruits started to come in. It has never been a secret that they want to be an FBS school, and I think this is why we've all been watching UTSA closely. I have heard from the very beginning the CUSA is where they would like to end up. Of course, the posters here and on Bobcatfans would like to see their teams end up there, it does not mean that it is going to happen.

In regards to your concern about another FBS talent suck, you have to remember that FCS teams like Texas State, Sam Houston, and now UTSA have always gone after UNT, UH, Rice, UTEP caliber players. We may not get them all the time, but all of our schools are looking for "D1" talent. Looking back last year's commits, some of our recruits had offers from North Texas, UTEP, Purdue, Fresno State, Missouri, Iowa State just to name a few. Players pick their schools for any number of reasons. Some want the D1 bowl attached their name, some are just looking for a ride so they can get their education, some want playing time (which could happen sooner if they drop down a level), while others want to stay close to home.

I would guess that the addition of two new FCS teams (UTSA and Lamar) has as much impact on recruiting for Sunbelt / CUSA teams as Incarnate Word's new football team has on Southland Schools.

I believe that their athletic fee will peak at $20/SCH (as will Texas State's).

Edited June 9, 2009 by Chrisattsu

[UNTflyer]

"UTSA will sign its first recruiting class in February and is scheduled to compete as a Football Championship Subdivision (i.e., Division I-AA) member beginning in 2011. From there, UTSA's goal is to eventually become part of Conference USA.

They will do it, too. And, we will be watching it all go down from the Sun Belt.

Bullshit. There is no way UTSA goes to C-USA before the conference gets settled in and comfortable with its makeup. They start FCS in 2011. *IF* the NCAA permits them to move after never playing football before, then it's a minimum of 3 years provisional before they can join (2014).

The more likely scenario is that UTSA plays in the Southland for 4 years minimum before the NCAA considers their request (2015), then 3 years provisional (2018). Meaning they don't become full members until 2019. Do you think C-USA will wait around for 10 years with their fingers crossed that they'll get Hyphenated-State University? Hell no. If UTSA moves to Div I-A, it's going to be the Sun Belt.

That's what their dream should be!

[Chrisattsu]

Bullshit. There is no way UTSA goes to C-USA before the conference gets settled in and comfortable with its makeup. They start FCS in 2011. *IF* the NCAA permits them to move after never playing football before, then it's a minimum of 3 years provisional before they can join (2014).

The more likely scenario is that UTSA plays in the Southland for 4 years minimum before the NCAA considers their request (2015), then 3 years provisional (2018). Meaning they don't become full members until 2019. Do you think C-USA will wait around for 10 years with their fingers crossed that they'll get Hyphenated-State University? Hell no. If UTSA moves to Div I-A, it's going to be the Sun Belt.

That's what their dream should be!

At this time, UTSA has not filed a request to be added to the SLC schedule. In addition to that, the SLC commish stated that he did not want any team to (UTSA, Lamar, TAMCC, UTA) to join the league long enough to move to FBS. Maybe they two are agreeing to leave it alone. UTSA will start as an FCS independent, and move up from there?

[MeanGreen61]

"UTSA will sign its first recruiting class in February and is scheduled to compete as a Football Championship Subdivision (i.e., Division I-AA) member beginning in 2011. From there, UTSA's goal is to eventually become part of Conference USA.

They will do it, too. And, we will be watching it all go down from the Sun Belt.

BMW

[UNTflyer]

At this time, UTSA has not filed a request to be added to the SLC schedule. In addition to that, the SLC commish stated that he did not want any team to (UTSA, Lamar, TAMCC, UTA) to join the league long enough to move to FBS. Maybe they two are agreeing to leave it alone. UTSA will start as an FCS independent, and move up from there?

There's also the issue of the current moratorium for FBS. Some say they don't anticipate the NCAA lifting it in 2011, that 120 teams is enough given the economic climate and the big debate over the BC$.

[LoveMG]

There's also the issue of the current moratorium for FBS. Some say they don't anticipate the NCAA lifting it in 2011, that 120 teams is enough given the economic climate and the big debate over the BC$.

if the moratorium is lifted watch as the bcs forces a split into two 70 team divisions over money. 1-a and 1-aa all over again.

[nana21]

Sadly, there probably are too many Division I athletic programs already. I think NJIT proved that.

Edited June 10, 2009 by nana21

[Daddy Dumpsalot]

This will happen because UTSA has no professional football team, is a huge city, will create another rivalry in Texas and one that is not 30 miles from another, and they have an accomplished coach. They will have great fan support and traveling crowd because of this. This would be a very smart move for CUSA to invite them to their conference.

[stebo]

Why is it that everyone seems to think that the UT-San Antonio Roadrunners... who have never even had a PRACTICE yet... don't even have players yet or locker rooms or anything... why is it that THEY will be a commodity? They have never been competitive in basketball. They average less than 1,000 a game. San Antonio is THE most dangerous place to live in the country according to the newest info... Gangs and Mexican Nationals run rampant. The people that are there... if they care about college football, care about UT. In fact, UT-SA has a deal worked out with UT just like every other UT system school where you complete your first two years there and as long as you have a 3.0 GPA, you are auto-admitted to UT (45 minutes up the road). This has essentially turned them into a Junior College. The kids that can't get into UT, go there for a couple of years - keep their GPA up, make mom and pop happy by showing that they can knock out the basics in JUCO UTSA... and then they get to play for their last 2 or 3 years in Austin so that they can enjoy a real college experience. My g/f went there and felt like she was in High School still. A ton of the high school students go there to get high school and college credit at the same time. The rest of the student population are parents knocking out night classes. It is so commuter that it is not even commuter. No campus life to speak of. None. No pride. Did they vote in a fee? Yes - but when only a couple thousand vote in the election due to serious apathy - you can get any fee passed. There were no students picketing and trying to change that vote - those kids could care less because they are outta there. It will take decades to reverse the current attitudes and turn things around there.

Will they be funded properly? Maybe. But without fans, a highly funded program doesn't do you much good. Ask SMU. Even with all their tradition and millions upon millions of dollars - they are LUCKY to get 15K for a game... and that is a very special game like TCU. They might show more in their box scores but I live in Dallas and have been to plenty of games, the stands are empty.

UTSA is DECADES away from being competitive and are not the solution for any conference expansion at all - whether that be for CUSA or the Belt. We can schedule some OOC games with them or something. Let's see how many fans show up.

And please don't bring up the Florida situation and how UCF/USF rose from nowhere to a power. There were 3 programs in the state of Florida before UCF moved up. They were followed by USF, FAU, and FIU so there are now 7. That is about the max for any state. Texas is topped out at 9 already. I don't see UTSA ever drawing the fans that they will need to really get to FBS. You have to average 15K a game and I seriously doubt that will happen anytime in the near future with that school. And what is this about a stadium? Every article that I have ever read has said they would play in the Alamo Dome. Is the article wrong or are they referring to some practice fields?

[UNTflyer]

This will happen because UTSA has no professional football team, is a huge city, will create another rivalry in Texas and one that is not 30 miles from another, and they have an accomplished coach. They will have great fan support and traveling crowd because of this. This would be a very smart move for CUSA to invite them to their conference.

Larry Coker ruined Miami Hurricane football, that was his accomplishment. All those coaching positions that opened in the last 2 years and he didn't get a whiff.

Now Coker may be Coach for Life down there at UTSA, but you are giving a lot of credit to a school that hasn't played a single down of football in its history.

[UNTflyer]

Texas is topped out at 9 already.

10 actually, but your post is spot on.

[The Fake Lonnie Finch]

It's funny to think the NCAA would try to keep college football out of San Antonio. But, some here think it anyway.

UTSA will likely go the FAU and USF route of being independent then hopping straight to C-USA. They won't bother with the Southland Conference. There won't be any reason to. The NCAA will fall all over itself to help UTSA.

Now, this will anger some of our fans and alumni. But why? Because they've decided to be more serious about football than our decision makers have been? That's not their fault; it's ours. We sit by and watch high school coaches get hired. They get a long time college coach with a national title under his belt to build their program, a la FAU.

Quit worrying about it. There's no reason to be mad at them when they surpass us. If we're not collectively going to demand better, we're not going to get better. So, just hope the summer workouts go well. And, hope Nelson, Deloach and Gandy can pull the defense and special teams together enough to get us competitive again in 2009.

[LoveMG]

you are giving a lot of credit to a school that hasn't played a single down of football in its history.

unt has played 90 years of football. but if utsa had a new team this year they might be favored over us in a game in san antone.

[gangrene]

And what is this about a stadium? Every article that I have ever read has said they would play in the Alamo Dome. Is the article wrong or are they referring to some practice fields?

I have to assume they are referencing one of the four stadiums they are building within their proposed athletics complex. If so, the term "stadium" should be used very loosely. The largest capacity of the proposed stadiums is 5,000 (expandable to 10K) for the soccer stadium.

But, the article sure doesn't clarify that. It's misleading and makes it seem as if UTSA is building a football stadium.

[stebo]

Lonnie,

I do not mean to offend you.. but I really feel that your anger towards the athletic department at NT has messed up your judgement of UT-SA's potential. Who will attend these games? Everyone always points to San Antonio not having a football team - well, there is a reason for that. They are more interested in "Futball" than football (the general public). The students will not attend these games. The games as an Indy IAA will be against the smallest of all small names and I doubt that people will come just for UT-SA, so that hurts them. No pride. No tradition. No local fever for this. This was not a community drive - this drive to get football was put together by some ambitious college admins. They are within a 45 minute drive of UT and most college fans in that city have adopted them or are simply alumni. Maybe in a couple of decades they can build something nice - but telling those kids that they will ever play for any type of championship is rubbage. They will be playing teams like SW Arkansas or Louisiana College their first 3 or 4 years. I don't see them getting the student base to suddenly decide that they will cheer on UT-SA athletics. They have been Div I for years and those students simply are not interested for all of the reasons that I pointed to above.

You can want something really bad and that is great... but if nobody else cares, well - what good does it do? FAU did a great job with a legendary coach but they are still at Lockhart and you don't hear Howie talking about Natl Championships anymore. Now they are just happy to be competitive in the Belt.

UT-SA and Texas State both have lots of potential. But so do North Texas, Rice, Houston, SMU, etc, etc.. North Texas at least had a split student population when we brought in major football. A Greek Row - with million dollar homes and student clubs that thrive. A healthy student nightlife scene. ANd even though the pride was small - there was a history that could be drawn from. It took about 12 years to really get them to come around and by "come around" - I mean that the student section is full on special occasions now. Try building up some sort of campus pride from scratch... no student life, no club support, no tradition, a true commuter school, and playing games in the Alama Dome which puts distance between the students and the playing field even more. I do not believe that the San Antonio communtiy will show up for these games - the same way that they did not show up when the Saints were playing there temporarily... and the Saints had attractice opponents coming in. UT-SA will be playing in front of a very empty stadium against teams much less heard of than Troy or Arkie State. If the Roadrunners are not going to play in the SLC, they will have to piece together a schedule from the Great West teams, I assume... Teams like North and South Dakota and Colorado Southern and New Jersey IT. Yikes - how do you get anyone out to watch those matchups? Answer - you don't.

Can they do it? Sure. But it is decades away and they have to change the entire city's attitude towards the school as well as the student base. Beating Sam Houston State in their 4th year as their lone win will not do it bud. They would be smart to go the SLC route and than talk the whole league into moving up with them. They have to have 5 FBS home games for each of their 2 year transitional period (which is a good 8 years away if the lift happens). Who will be those teams?

Texas State has potential... they are still a ways off - but they have potential. UT-SA is no different (to me) than Florida A&M declaring that they would go to IA, wishful thinking. That kid should seriously conisder going to Iowa or Colorado if those offers really exist. But "offers" and "interest" often get mixed up, especially in school PR pieces.

Edited June 10, 2009 by stebo

[GrandGreen]

UTSA will have a rough go. They do have some great advantages such as a mega-city location with little local sports competition. They also got a great commitment from their student body for an athletic fee that maxes out at $480 a year. A disadvantage and advantage is, it is a new program. As such there will be a lot of excitement and support at the beginning but also there is no tradition and as a start up it could get very difficult to jump into the FB division. I assume that the Southland will admit UTSA as a football player member as they are already be in that conference.

It will be very difficult for any program such as Texas State at San Marcos or UTSA to get into the FB division. Remember the key component is to be able to get a FB division schedule and without a conference sponsor this could be very difficult. Although it seems that the majority on this board seem to think it would be just dandy to add more FB programs in Texas, I doubt that the other FB division universities' administrations see it that way. Despite our Texas State posters' accretion there are very few players that will sign with a lower division school if given other choices. I really doubt any of CUSA Texas members want another team in Texas to recruit against. The facts are that most of the top one hundred and fifty to two hundred sought after Texas recruits are grabbed by name conference teams. The balance of the 350 average Texas recruiting class are mostly signed by the lower level conferences. It is out of this pool that TCU, SMU, Rice, UH, UTEP and NT get the majority of their class. I doubt that the six Texas lower tier FB universities want to further dilute this recruiting pool by adding two more competitors. The one thing that adding these two schools will do, is put Texas firmly in front of the race for the state with the most high school football recruits as another 40 that are going to lower divisions now will get an opportunity to play FB Division football.

[Chrisattsu]

Lonnie,

I do not mean to offend you.. but I really feel that your anger towards the athletic department at NT has messed up your judgement of UT-SA's potential. Who will attend these games? Everyone always points to San Antonio not having a football team - well, there is a reason for that. They are more interested in "Futball" than football (the general public).

Whoa... Please clarify what you are saying because I am interpreting this as, "San Antonio is filled with brown people". Is there a large Hispanic community in San Antonio? Obviously, but it has diverse cultural heritage made up of all major ethnic groups. While North Texans (speaking of region not the University) would like to think that everything south of Austin in Mexico, we are still very much Texan down here. We like our beer cold, our chili hot, and our Friday night football. Have you ever looked at the Express News on Friday or Saturday during October? There is nothing, but football previews and scores.

The students will not attend these games. The games as an Indy IAA will be against the smallest of all small names and I doubt that people will come just for UT-SA, so that hurts them. No pride. No tradition. No local fever for this. This was not a community drive - this drive to get football was put together by some ambitious college admins. They are within a 45 minute drive of UT and most college fans in that city have adopted them or are simply alumni. Maybe in a couple of decades they can build something nice - but telling those kids that they will ever play for any type of championship is rubbage. They will be playing teams like SW Arkansas or Louisiana College their first 3 or 4 years. I don't see them getting the student base to suddenly decide that they will cheer on UT-SA athletics. They have been Div I for years and those students simply are not interested for all of the reasons that I pointed to above.

I agree that the IAA indy route is not the right road for the San Antonio market. Should they go this route, it will be a hard sell for the students, alumni, and potential Tshirt fans to remain avid followers after the initial buzz has worn off. The students do not have a history of supporting the University's athletics for the reasons mentioned in previous posts (CAP program, Non-trad students, and large city with more entertainment options). Could this change? Possibly. The creation of a football team has people talking about UTSA. This is creating buzz for their athletic program. I think two things that have hurt UTSA in the past are their location on the FAR Northwest-side of town and the fact every sport they participate in occurs during Spurs season (except Volleyball). Maybe the downtown location and the lack of local competition will draw a fan base.

UT-SA and Texas State both have lots of potential. But so do North Texas, Rice, Houston, SMU, etc, etc.. North Texas at least had a split student population when we brought in major football. A Greek Row - with million dollar homes and student clubs that thrive. A healthy student nightlife scene. ANd even though the pride was small - there was a history that could be drawn from. It took about 12 years to really get them to come around and by "come around" - I mean that the student section is full on special occasions now. Try building up some sort of campus pride from scratch... no student life, no club support, no tradition, a true commuter school, and playing games in the Alama Dome which puts distance between the students and the playing field even more.

Agreed

I do not believe that the San Antonio communtiy will show up for these games - the same way that they did not show up when the Saints were playing there temporarily... and the Saints had attractice opponents coming in.

They embraced the team, and sold out every game that was played in the Dome in 2005.

UT-SA will be playing in front of a very empty stadium against teams much less heard of than Troy or Arkie State. If the Roadrunners are not going to play in the SLC, they will have to piece together a schedule from the Great West teams, I assume... Teams like North and South Dakota and Colorado Southern and New Jersey IT. Yikes - how do you get anyone out to watch those matchups? Answer - you don't.

Playing SLC (or IAA teams) is not going to draw well and they know it. NJIT and UTPB joined the Great West, but both lack football.

Can they do it? Sure. But it is decades away and they have to change the entire city's attitude towards the school as well as the student base. Beating Sam Houston State in their 4th year as their lone win will not do it bud. They would be smart to go the SLC route and than talk the whole league into moving up with them. They have to have 5 FBS home games for each of their 2 year transitional period (which is a good 8 years away if the lift happens). Who will be those teams?

SLC will not move up. While there are the four Texas teams (TxSt, Lamar, UTSA, and Sam Houston) discussing moves to FBS, the other conference members lack the funding or desire to move to FBS.

[greenminer]

Don't confuse anger with demanding better.

I think some of us would love to see RV and Co. turn it around, but are afraid the current symptoms do not reflect a positive outcome (with some glimmbers of hope a la college coaching hires).

I think we can all agree that this season will be very telling.

[UNT90]

Quit worrying about it. There's no reason to be mad at them when they surpass us. If we're not collectively going to demand better, we're not going to get better. So, just hope the summer workouts go well. And, hope Nelson, Deloach and Gandy can pull the defense and special teams together enough to get us competitive again in 2009.

Seriously, San Antonio IS 30 miles from Austin, therefore everyone in San Antonio is a huge UT fan (much like everyone in Austin is a huge Spurs Fan). This is like saying if UT were in Dallas, and suddenly Texas Weslyan decided to start a football program, everyone in Fort Worth would magically stop being UT fans and convert to TWU. Won't happen. Look for them to average about 8 to 10K in attendance years 2-5 of the program (a little more in year one with a new stadium). You gotta remember: commuter school, non-traditional college students, and the biggest, no football history or tradition..

We should worry about SMU and TSU much more than the experiment in San Antonio.

[Censored by Laurie]

Seriously, San Antonio IS 30 miles from Austin, therefore everyone in San Antonio is a huge UT fan (much like everyone in Austin is a huge Spurs Fan). This is like saying if UT were in Dallas, and suddenly Texas Weslyan decided to start a football program, everyone in Fort Worth would magically stop being UT fans and convert to TWU. Won't happen. Look for them to average about 8 to 10K in attendance years 2-5 of the program (a little more in year one with a new stadium). You gotta remember: commuter school, non-traditional college students, and the biggest, no football history or tradition..

We should worry about SMU and TSU much more than the experiment in San Antonio.

Since we're issuing geography-based arguments...you do realize where Texas State is, right?

The point Lonnie is making is that UTSA has the leadership and the drive in place...and he is highly skeptical that UNT can say the same. I don't particularly agree with him, as I am satisfied, that considerring the hand he's been dealt, that RV has done an admirable job of building our atheltic department as a whole...but that doesn't make his concern any less valid.

You also may want to apply your reasoning as to why UTSA football would fail to another large state school...

[stebo]

UTSA is not building a football stadium - they are playing in the Alamo Dome.

No - I am not "anti-Latino" - San Antonio is a nice place to visit but is the most dangerous city in America now from the crime (per capita). My girlfriend's father attributes that to Katrina victims that never went back. I have TONS of friends that live there and have lived there... and I have spent quite a bit of time there on business myself. UTSA is 20 miles north of San Antonio proper so it is going to be really tough getting the small student population that DOES live on campus to follow the team. I don't see the citizens of San Antonio supporting this right off the bat, not without some big name schools coming to town. They do not support the current programs and neither do the students.

Look, I don't have a problem with UTSA. I admire them for trying. But to throw comments around that they will be an immediate threat is just comical to me.

North Texas at least had a past to draw from. Also - NT has a healthy student population that is "traditional" - no, not the entire 34,000 - but a good 15K of them live in or around the campus. We have a large Greek system with lots of support. Unline most schools in this country - the Greek system is growing rather than shrinking. Not that Greeks are the answer - but they show an indication of the "type" of student mentality we need... more traditional students wanting to move "off to school" and go home for summers instead of commuting from mom and dad's house. We also do not have a system set up to hand off our best students with GPA's over 3.0 directly to our main campus up the road. What you have left... the leftovers. The people that don't care about a student life. The mothers and fathers taking night classes... the students that did not make it a goal to get to UT in Austin or could care less because they are already married and settled down. It is just an entirely different mentality. It is what we used to have more of but have worked hard to get away from. If you walk on the UTSA campus, you will not see very much Roadrunner gear.

Good coach? Maybe. We shall see.. Lots of potential? Sure. An immediate threat? No freaking way. They are decades away from being a threat. Texas State on the other hand... they have been chipping away at this for a bit. The name change, the more traditional student, and a dedication to moving up. They remind me of Troy making the long trip to IA back in the day. But they need a conference and 5 IA games for 2 years (10 games will be very tough to schdule) and they need attendance. It doesn't matter how much money you throw at it, without fans - you cannot move up.

Edited June 10, 2009 by stebo

[nana21]

UTSA is not building a football stadium - they are playing in the Alamo Dome.

No - I am not "anti-Latino" - San Antonio is a nice place to visit but is the most dangerous city in America now from the crime (per capita). My girlfriend's father attributes that to Katrina victims that never went back. I have TONS of friends that live there and have lived there... and I have spent quite a bit of time there on business myself. UTSA is 20 miles north of San Antonio proper so it is going to be really tough getting the small student population that DOES live on campus to follow the team. I don't see the citizens of San Antonio supporting this right off the bat, not without some big name schools coming to town. They do not support the current programs and neither do the students.

The Alamodome is centrally located and about 15 miles from UTSA's Main Campus about 1 mile from its Downtown Campus. Look, I know they have a good coach and a nice facility but I don't know much more.

One thing I do know, however, is that North San Antonio is amazingly safe. I know this because I live here and UTSA's Main Campus is not too far from where I work so I see it everyday. If your suggesting people should be afraid to go to UTSA because it's dangerous then that's laughable. Just look across the street from it, there's a Neiman Marcus, Tiffany & CO. and a Ferrari dealership. lol, they don't build those things within a 2 mile radius of something that's not safe.

[stebo]

The Alamodome is centrally located and about 15 miles from UTSA's Main Campus about 1 mile from its Downtown Campus. Look, I know they have a good coach and a nice facility but I don't know much more.

One thing I do know, however, is that North San Antonio is amazingly safe. I know this because I live here and UTSA's Main Campus is not too far from where I work so I see it everyday. If your suggesting people should be afraid to go to UTSA because it's dangerous then that's laughable. Just look across the street from it, there's a Neiman Marcus, Tiffany & CO. and a Ferrari dealership. lol, they don't build those things within a 2 mile radius of something that's not safe.

Hey, I didn't name them that! Geez, lol... It was in the Austin paper last week. Some sort of statistic or poll or something. Kinda like "Houston is the fattest city in the country"... Don't take it personal. My g/f and her whole family are from there... and their theory is that the city got a lot of refugee's from Katrina and some bad apples stuck around. Of course there are nice parts... there are nice parts of Detroit as well.

As for the Dome being 15 miles away from main campus, that is kinda backing what I stated. There is a very small student population that actually lives on campus and "tries" to have a college atmosphere.... Playing the football games 20-30 minutes away from the main school will seriously hurt their "student" attendance. Tons of schools have had to deal with this over the years - including NT when we moved our games to the Cotton Bowl and Texas Stadium. No bueno for building student pride and tradition.

Edited June 11, 2009 by stebo