N C A A Puts Brakes On Division Movements

[MeanGreen61]

Posted on the Belt board by Arkstfan. No more moves up in classification until 2011. WKU just under the wire.

The NCAA Board of Directors on Thursday quieted one of the great annual off-season message board discussion topics, “Who is moving to I-A FBS football?” The Board imposed a four year moratorium on preventing institutions from moving into Division I or changing their Division I football subdivision.

The moratorium will not apply to Western Kentucky because the Hilltoppers have already notified the NCAA of their intent to reclassify and have started the reclassification process. The moratorium will also not apply to the 20 institutions that have already started the process of becoming Division I members.

Schools that have not begun the process must now wait until August of 2011 to start the process.

The NCAA is expected to examine current Division I membership criteria as well as the process of reclassifying to Division I during the moratorium period. Other ideas that may be considered may include going to a four division format by splitting Division III or possibly subdividing Division III which has been growing rapidly. As of May of this year Division I had 326 members, Division II 281 and Division III 420. The rapid growth of Divisions I and III have been of some concern, especially in Division III where the ratio of teams to post-season opportunities is growing rapidly.

[UNTflyer]

Western Kentucky will be the 120th DIV I team.

This would be the perfect time to try to align DIV-I into 10 12-team conferences.

[GreenTiger_OriginalAcct]

Posted on the Belt board by Arkstfan. No more moves up in classification until 2011. WKU just under the wire.

The NCAA Board of Directors on Thursday quieted one of the great annual off-season message board discussion topics, “Who is moving to I-A FBS football?” The Board imposed a four year moratorium on preventing institutions from moving into Division I or changing their Division I football subdivision.

The moratorium will not apply to Western Kentucky because the Hilltoppers have already notified the NCAA of their intent to reclassify and have started the reclassification process. The moratorium will also not apply to the 20 institutions that have already started the process of becoming Division I members.

Schools that have not begun the process must now wait until August of 2011 to start the process.

The NCAA is expected to examine current Division I membership criteria as well as the process of reclassifying to Division I during the moratorium period. Other ideas that may be considered may include going to a four division format by splitting Division III or possibly subdividing Division III which has been growing rapidly. As of May of this year Division I had 326 members, Division II 281 and Division III 420. The rapid growth of Divisions I and III have been of some concern, especially in Division III where the ratio of teams to post-season opportunities is growing rapidly.

Here is what is truly amazing. There are over 300 Div III teams with football programs. And they have a playoff. With an undisputed champion.

I am done now. With my short semi-sentences.

[Guest GrayEagleOne]

Western Kentucky will be the 120th DIV I team.

This would be the perfect time to try to align DIV-I into 10 12-team conferences.

I totally agree but the NCAA doesn't have the intestional fortitude to do that. The other voting members won't stand up to Notre Dame, Army, Navy, or the Pac-10.

[Eagle1855]

GOOD!

[GreenBlooded1]

I totally agree but the NCAA doesn't have the intestional fortitude to do that. The other voting members won't stand up to Notre Dame, Army, Navy, or the Pac-10.

You call it intestinal fortitude... I call it something else.

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

I totally agree but the NCAA doesn't have the intestinal fortitude to do that. The other voting members won't stand up to Notre Dame, Army, Navy, or the Pac-10.

--I would toss the entire Big-X into that collection before I would put the entire Pac-10 in.... Army and Navy are just different cats to start with.... they really are not regional teams and develop their athletic programs completely differently. The Eastern/Midwestern schools seem to look down on the rest of the world as being "Country Bumpkins" and not worthy of expressing opinions. The four California programs (USC, UCLA, Cal-Berkley, Stanford) are very little better. When we defeat them they often then claim...."Oh well we are academic schools, not athletic diploma mills!". I never understand how some here could ever support those guys against a Texas/Southwest team (except SMU)..

---Glad to see them slow down the I-A growth down.... The next growth will likely come as conferences restructure some. What can possibly do about division III, they have to play somewhere... split it???

---From: a long-time Texas family---

[Cowtown]

I think I need to go take a Division Movement.

You call it intestinal fortitude... I call it something else.

[flyeater]

I totally agree but the NCAA doesn't have the intestional fortitude to do that. The other voting members won't stand up to Notre Dame, Army, Navy, or the Pac-10.

It has nothing to do with intestinal fortitude. In this area, member schools and conferences are not beholdant (sp) to the NCAA, thus it can't govern conference alignments and memberships. It just adds to the giant rule/regs book schools must play by. The NCAA can let in more schools (20???!!!!), but it can't dictate with whom they align. For the same reason, the NCAA can't determine if a playoff will/won't happen. It can, though, decertify bowls if they don't meet financial/attendance obligations.

Damn, that's a lot of /'s in one post.

Edited August 10, 2007 by flyeater

[UNTflyer]

For the same reason, the NCAA can't determine if a playoff will/won't happen.

Sure they can. Here's how.

Create an official NCAA Football Championship. It's the only DIV-I sport that doesn't have one.

They've already declared that conferences must have 12 teams to hold a conference championship game.

They then state that automatic bids to the new playoff system will go to the conference champions, with 4 at-large bids to the highest ranked non-champions.

Voila! A 16 team playoff!

[Guest GrayEagleOne]

--I would toss the entire Big-X into that collection before I would put the entire Pac-10 in.... Army and Navy are just different cats to start with.... they really are not regional teams and develop their athletic programs completely differently. The Eastern/Midwestern schools seem to look down on the rest of the world as being "Country Bumpkins" and not worthy of expressing opinions. The four California programs (USC, UCLA, Cal-Berkley, Stanford) are very little better. When we defeat them they often then claim...."Oh well we are academic schools, not athletic diploma mills!". I never understand how some here could ever support those guys against a Texas/Southwest team (except SMU)..

---Glad to see them slow down the I-A growth down.... The next growth will likely come as conferences restructure some. What can possibly do about division III, they have to play somewhere... split it???

---From: a long-time Texas family---

The Big 10 has been willing to expand for some time, as long as Notre Dame is the 12th team. It was rumored that the Big 10 took the 11th team (Penn State) to entice Notre Dame into being the 12th member. They are again rumored to be looking again for a 12th member. There were just two words that kept them thinking that they were better than everyone else....Jim Delaney.

The Pac-10 is too snooty. They refuse to take one of the California State teams (San Diego State, Fresno State). Brigham Young outddraws all but a couple of the Pac 10 universityes buy they are not liberal enough. Utah also doesn't fit their footprint. Hawaii is liberal but they're too far. Several potential candidates are higher scholastically than the Washington and Oregon colleges. Beshides they seem unwilling to split the pie twelve ways.

Air Force is not a regional team either but they have been in a conference for some forty years now. Army was in a conference (CUSA) a few years back. If they can't compete with the other FBS teams then they should drop to the FCS as the Ivy schools did. Even with their different method of recruiting, Navy has proved that they can compete with other (1A) schools.

It would still be great to have ten 12-team conferences. It could be done with less than a nominal amount of shifting and save untold thousands in travel costs.

[jimbojimjim]

The moratorium will not apply to Western Kentucky because the Hilltoppers have already notified the NCAA of their intent to reclassify and have started the reclassification process. The moratorium will also not apply to the 20 institutions that have already started the process of becoming Division I members.

Schools that have not begun the process must now wait until August of 2011 to start the process.

Does anyone know who these other 20 teams are?

[UNTflyer]

Does anyone know who these other 20 teams are?

W. Kentucky is one.

[shaneb]

W. Kentucky is one.

I think the 20 teams mentioned are those vying for Div1 status, but AA not A. WKU is the only school I know of looking to move from 1AA to 1A. Its a stellar idea in my opinion. You have to draw the line somewhere or eventually all the schools at the very top will leave for an upper-upper tier. I also think they outta cap/cutback the bowl games, but that's just my opinion.

[jimbojimjim]

I think the 20 teams mentioned are those vying for Div1 status, but AA not A. WKU is the only school I know of looking to move from 1AA to 1A. Its a stellar idea in my opinion. You have to draw the line somewhere or eventually all the schools at the very top will leave for an upper-upper tier. I also think they outta cap/cutback the bowl games, but that's just my opinion.

Okay. That can get confussing. I would agree that there needs to be a pace set for schools moving up in Divisions. Eventually, we are going to see several D1AA schools move to D1A as they gain the support, money, etc to do so. Quite frankly, there are some schools that should probably be on that track right now. I guess we will see what happens in 2011.

[Arkstfan]

The NCAA essentially has no power.

In the NFL, MLB, NBA, NHL, MLS, etc the governing body has total authority to determine how many franchises may exist and have some limited authority to determine the territory they may compete in. In those systems the governing body came first (not totally accurate in regards to MLB but never mind that) and each franchise was created by fiat of the association.

In the NCAA the members created the governing body and retain the control. Some time back the governance structure was modified so that in Division I governance is on a conference basis rather than an institution basis (one school, one vote has basically been repealed and may only be invoked in very limited circumstances).

While 120 teams divided by 10 conferences makes math sense it makes no reality sense. The ultimate power in Division I rests in the hands of 11 university presidents, one from each FBS conference. In that group there is no reason for the representatives of the Sun Belt, WAC, MWC, Pac-10, Big East and Big 12 to mandate 12 member football conferences. That's 6 of 11 votes. There is no reason for the SEC, ACC, Big 12, and to lesser degrees CUSA and MAC to mandate 12 member football conferences because more conference title games dilutes the value of their own title game product. Essentially none of the 11 have any incentive to make it happen.

As to Army and Navy, they have a lucrative television deal for their game. Joining a 12 member conference moves that game off the last Saturday of the season reducing the value of the game. CUSA's bent toward a 12th team provided strong incentive for Army to leave. A national CBS audience on a date with few games is worth much more to them than being one of many the week before.

The NCAA is facing a number of significant issues. The three biggest right now are the growth of Division I (not in the football area but basketball), the growth of Division III, and the possibility of the NAIA collapsing.

In Division I there has been rapid growth with schools like Central Arkansas, South Dakota State, North Dakota State, Cal-Davis, Longwood, New Jersey Institute of Technology, Utah Valley, etc moving into Division I. Some already have a conference home but there are others along with some independents who in the near term may align to form Division I's 32nd conference. Once the 32nd legal conference forms we have to move to a second play-in game has to be added and additional Tournament shares awarded diluting the pool. An extra conference also means an added share paid out for the direct conference support. Each school added also means additional revenue sharing from the other pools (one paying based on number of sports sponsored, another paying based on number of scholarships awarded). The growth in Division I means less money for UNT and less money for Texas. Forget football in this equation because the only revenue sharing in football is in the independently run BCS which is a private association of the 11 FBS conferences.

Division III is a big issue. The Division's membership is strongly divided nearly in half over a number of issues, such as: inital eligibility, continuing eligibility, red-shirting, limits on other forms of aid, and playoff participation. Division III has become so large that getting a playoff spot is very difficult.

Many observers believe that Division III will be split into III & IV. Division III will be highly restrictive and IV a bit looser. The issue may end up being how free-wheeling IV can be because there is some belief that a less restrictive Division IV that does not allow "ability based" aid but allows some sort of need based aid set by formula behind the straight Federal student aid system could result in a number of Division II teams moving into IV. We've got similar systems in Division I. For example the Patriot caps aid to student athletes based on a financial need basis. If mom and dad are making good money a quarterback might get zero dollars but the running back with a poor family might get what is roughly equal to a full-ride at other schools.

The next issue is the NAIA. The NCAA already had a moratorium on schools moving from the NAIA to Division III and will phase that out by permitting five schools per year to move. The thought is that if they removed the roadblocks that the NAIA could lose at least half or more of its 300 members essentially killing the association and making the NCAA's monopoly situation even worse placing it under even greater legal and legislative scrutiny. Some significant lawsuits involving the NCAA have turned on the fact that there is an alternate association even though it is not seen as a particularly attractive alternative (Tarkanian v. NCAA).

What the NCAA needs right now is breathing room.

My expectation is that there will be a change to FBS/FCS membership. FBS members will be those schools who are a member of one of the 11 conferences that sponsor FBS football as long as they retain the 8 required members and those members meet the current criteria or will be schools not in those conferences who meet a significantly higher standard, with the justification being that a school in a conference has the support network in place to play FBS football while independents without the built-in scheduling and post-season opportunities will need to demonstrate a higher degree of internal support. That will essentially freeze FBS membership except when a conference chooses to add a member. Division I membership standards will be raised requiring more scholarships awarded and maybe more sports. Division III will be split into III and IV.