Student Stadium Fee

[the real grad88]

Instead of a small fee spread out to the students, why not a larger fee spread among the season ticket holders?

People are a little too willing to push the check in front of others.

From what I have been told the BOR is not going to pass this fee, the students are going to pass it either. Someone besides current students will have to pay for it. I am no expert, but again, from what I was told, if 8 - 12 million can be raised, the school is willing to bond the rest.

Maybe you are right, let's just put this thing on hold for say...20 years. Season ticket holders have NEVER paid for a stadium. Scholarships and other costs of running a program are just too expensive and eat up all available funds. We will never get 15,000 season ticket holders at UNT with the current stadium...which is the number it would take to actually build a new stadium...AND those season ticket holders have to stay with you for about 20 YEARS. We have got to build the stadium in order to get the season ticket holders.

[Cerebus]

Maybe you are right, let's just put this thing on hold for say...20 years. Season ticket holders have NEVER paid for a stadium. Scholarships and other costs of running a program are just too expensive and eat up all available funds. We will never get 15,000 season ticket holders at UNT with the current stadium...which is the number it would take to actually build a new stadium...AND those season ticket holders have to stay with you for about 20 YEARS. We have got to build the stadium in order to get the season ticket holders.

The North Texas athletic department is going to have to raise a significant amount of money, say 8 to 12 million dollars. At that point the school will bond out the rest, at that point the school will probably find some way to reclassify some of the costs as infrastructure and make part of the payment, but the rest is going to be passed onto the fans in the form of higher prices for the MGC, season tickets, etc.

It might be possible that when the stadium is done, or even better as funding comes to a near completion, the excitement of a new stadium will change the minds of the students and make them want to pay for part of it with a fee increase. I still doubt that though.

The danger of being in a closed loop system like gmg.com is you get "green tower syndrome". Not everyone is excited about football. You have to admit the majority of UNT students never step foot in fouts. They don't want to pay some $30 fee to build a new stadium and more than they want to pay a $30 fee to buy new accelerators for the physics department.

[shaft]

The best financing tool in addition to the capital campaign is to have the student body vote to continue the building fee that is currently assessed to pay for the new medical center. Once the debt has been retired on the current projects have the fee continue to be used for the stadium. It's not a "new" fee but simply a continuation of one that already exists and is about to expire.

[Go_UTA]

It is a hard thing. We have a similar situation with wanting to build an arena on campus in Arlington. The students HAVE voted to pay for the operation of it when and if it comes on line (a big thing), but the administration is NOT asking them to fund the construction. I don't think they will.

(At least in theory, an arena could be a bit easier to fund than a stadium, because the rental opportunities are probably greater.)

University presidents WANT their athletic departments to do well, as there are a lot of benefits from that (pride, rallying point, positive publicity, etc.).

However, in the end, universities - and their presidents - are not evaluated by the performance of their athletic teams. They are evaluated by the criteria set-up by the state (Coordinating Board, Legislative Budget Board). As we have all heard, what gets measured gets managed.

In fact, if presidents channel too many financial resources to athletics beyond what can at least be reasonably justified, they start getting into hot water...faculty and students start to rebel, achieving core needs starts to sufffer, people who really make decisions (regents, legislators, etc.) start to question their compentence, etc. (Of course, I am talking about life of the athletic "have nots," which are in the majority.)

BTW, the bonds that are paying for the health clinic building are probably 20 or 30 year bonds. So, don't expect that capacity to come off line any time soon. Plus, by then, the clinic will need a renovation!

[Cr1028]

As a student, to me, the $30 fee is so small compared to the thousands I spend on tuition and fees every semester. If paying an extra $30 can build a stronger base of student support I am all for it. I am so sick of seeing people at our school wearing UT, ATM, and OU gear.

[MeanMag]

As a student, to me, the $30 fee is so small compared to the thousands I spend on tuition and fees every semester. If paying an extra $30 can build a stronger base of student support I am all for it. I am so sick of seeing people at our school wearing UT, ATM, and OU gear.

I feel the same way. If RV came up to me and asked me for $30 to help fund a new stadium I would hand him the cash on the spot if I knew every other student was going to do the same.

[the real grad88]

Maybe you are right, let's just put this thing on hold for say...20 years. Season ticket holders have NEVER paid for a stadium. Scholarships and other costs of running a program are just too expensive and eat up all available funds. We will never get 15,000 season ticket holders at UNT with the current stadium...which is the number it would take to actually build a new stadium...AND those season ticket holders have to stay with you for about 20 YEARS. We have got to build the stadium in order to get the season ticket holders.

Good points, but I don't agree with the comment about the majority of UNT students never setting foot at Fouts. When we have 10,000 students showing up to a lot of games, that is a 1/3rd of the student enrollment. I would venture to say that most colleges don't get more than a 1/3rd of student enrollment at any one game. Most fans are alums. I think we have the student support to get a $30.00 fee to support a new stadium. I mean $30.00? That is nothing in light of the overall costs of higher ed. That's not even half of one text book.

Edited January 29, 2007 by the real grad88

[greenminer]

Good points, but I don't agree with the comment about the majority of UNT students never setting foot at Fouts. When we have 10,000 students showing up to a lot of games, that is a 1/3rd of the student enrollment. I would venture to say that most colleges don't get more than a 1/3rd of student enrollment at any one game. Most fans are alums. I think we have the student support to get a $30.00 fee to support a new stadium. I mean $30.00? That is nothing in light of the overall costs of higher ed. That's not even half of one text book.

Who told you we have gotten 10K for a single game? Maybe for the bigger ones, like the NMSU/Belt championship game...or the Baylor game. But 10K? We average, what, 15K total (I might be a little off, but that's not the point), and you're insinuating that 2/3 of those people are current students...

...riiiiiight /dr. evil.

[the real grad88]

Who told you we have gotten 10K for a single game? Maybe for the bigger ones, like the NMSU/Belt championship game...or the Baylor game. But 10K? We average, what, 15K total (I might be a little off, but that's not the point), and you're insinuating that 2/3 of those people are current students...

...riiiiiight /dr. evil.

When we were winning, most games that I went to, the student side was full...that's about 10,000 students...about 1/3rd of student enrollment. When we have played big games (SMU and Baylor and NMSU, etc), there have been more than 10,000 students.

[Cerebus]

Good points, but I don't agree with the comment about the majority of UNT students never setting foot at Fouts. When we have 10,000 students showing up to a lot of games, that is a 1/3rd of the student enrollment.

2/3 > 1/3 = majority

Enrollment was ~34,000 this semester, so until ~17,001 students show up at a game....

I think we have the student support to get a $30.00 fee to support a new stadium. I mean $30.00? That is nothing in light of the overall costs of higher ed. That's not even half of one text book.

I'de love to be proven wrong, but I have to disagree. Just because you love mean green football, doesn't mean the majority on campus like it enough to fork over $30 a semester.

[greenminer]

When we were winning, most games that I went to, the student side was full...that's about 10,000 students...about 1/3rd of student enrollment. When we have played big games (SMU and Baylor and NMSU, etc), there have been more than 10,000 students.

I'd like to think that's the case, but my perception of that side was that there were a ton of greeks, the band, but then a LOT of their friends: parents/fam/other...i.e. non-UNT students.

It'd be nice to know you're right. I just have this image in my head of the student crowds at the Sun Bowl for UTEP games, which seemingly dwarfed my experiences at Fouts (on the student side). And they were maybe close to 10K. You could very well be right, as the aforementioned numbers really are just my own estimates and I can't think of any site that has a log of actual student ticket counts to confirm anything.

If nearly a third of the students were showing up for home games when we were winning, I'd be even more dumbfounded by the then-voted against stadium fee.

[the real grad88]

My point is that we have the same percentage of students attending home games as most schools...with the exception of TX A&M, which is the largest cult in the world. Other schools get new stadiums without raising all the funds, surely we can too. As for as the student side having a lot of family members making up the 10,000 figure that I threw out, I don't think that is true, from my experience as a student. I remember the student side in the 80s when we were IAA. There were a lot of games in which the student side was completely full--way outnumbering the alumni side, and I don't remember it being because of families. It was almost all students as for as I remember.

[UNTSIG]

i am a huge fan of rv. i think that he has done an extraordinary job at UNT. this however would be my one complaint. when they tried to pass the student fee for athletics a few years ago, i was involved a lot in student leadership. they sold this thing completely the wrong way. i believe that RV would say that too. we tried to push to much to fast and turned it into the pro-athletics, pro-music debate which it is not. if you remember, we had just passed the rec center fee one year earlier, was coming off our best season ('02) and was trying to "up" the athletics fee partly under the cloud that it was to bring us to Title IX compliance. also, the vote was rejected by the students and then passed by student goverment to bring us into Title IX compliance. the mistake was made when they decided to pitch this idea to the students imo. nobody cared nor would have noticed if we wouldn't have asked. hindsight is 20/20.... we can not squander the good will that we have created with the hiring of Todd Dodge right now by either trying again immediately to pass the fee or just sneaking it in. give it a year, wait til next spring and then throw it out there again and package it together nicely. i think that the other important thing to remember this time around is how much the students at North Texas have really changed. people are a lot more prideful in North Texas than what they used to be. i think this is due a lot to the experience new freshmen receive when they come to the university through oreintation. also at the time there was no Matress Mac or Goldfield donations. the perception was that the students were going to take this all on themselves. get one more "big" donation announced, have an exciting season and throw it out there again!

[the real grad88]

i am a huge fan of rv. i think that he has done an extraordinary job at UNT. this however would be my one complaint. when they tried to pass the student fee for athletics a few years ago, i was involved a lot in student leadership. they sold this thing completely the wrong way. i believe that RV would say that too. we tried to push to much to fast and turned it into the pro-athletics, pro-music debate which it is not. if you remember, we had just passed the rec center fee one year earlier, was coming off our best season ('02) and was trying to "up" the athletics fee partly under the cloud that it was to bring us to Title IX compliance. also, the vote was rejected by the students and then passed by student goverment to bring us into Title IX compliance. the mistake was made when they decided to pitch this idea to the students imo. nobody cared nor would have noticed if we wouldn't have asked. hindsight is 20/20.... we can not squander the good will that we have created with the hiring of Todd Dodge right now by either trying again immediately to pass the fee or just sneaking it in. give it a year, wait til next spring and then throw it out there again and package it together nicely. i think that the other important thing to remember this time around is how much the students at North Texas have really changed. people are a lot more prideful in North Texas than what they used to be. i think this is due a lot to the experience new freshmen receive when they come to the university through oreintation. also at the time there was no Matress Mac or Goldfield donations. the perception was that the students were going to take this all on themselves. get one more "big" donation announced, have an exciting season and throw it out there again!

Agree totally.

[eeally]

What about 5 $ games next year. UT,A&M,LSU,OU and OSU.....$600,000 to 1 mil a pop and Dodge telling recruits you will play against some of D1's finest.

Maybe an upset or 2.....Think about it. We need $ and 1 $ game a year just pays for the program. Lets pump it up a bit. Ignite the Alumni base and pull of some wins in OOC. Donations would start pouring in. As for the students they will just have to live with a small stadium fee. Most don't care! SGA is a joke when it concerns the student body! 50% or more get $ from their parents and most get a student loan. As for the worker students what is 1 more lunch shift waiting tables in the grand scheme of things when you can be proud of your university.

It is time UNT got some pride and the time is now!!!!

Sometimes I feel like Plumm!

We are on track to be Texas #2 school. Why don't we act like it?

[shaft]

.

Edited January 31, 2007 by shaft