untjim1995

I love the Hayden Fry stories when he was here, especially the efforts he put in to get people interested. BUt the problem was that he still couldn't get people to come out and watch the team play, even when they were really good and got ranked. This town and this university don't care about UNT sports--they never have and they never will. I was looking at the list of G5 schools that FFR posted earlier in this thread--every single one of them puts revenue athletics as the top window to the university to connect to their alumni, students, faculty, local fans, and future students and fans. A school like Utah State, who was moribund in football, still figures out a way to get into the MWC. Now, they play people their fans care about and that recruits want to play at and they are good now. They have placed an emphasis on Stew Morrill's hoops program, which has paid off dearly for them over the years. What they didn't do was place an emphasis on music or arts to be THE window to the university--just like every other school on that list. We don't--never have, never will. Maybe our school's tact is the right move--training future educators, musicians, and artists have significant value to society. Sophistication is often thought of with those three endeavors. It isn't with football or basketball--both are thought of raw, unsophisticated, even appalling to many folks. A school of higher education is supposed to focus on the quality of the academics and well-roundedness of its students learning options--maybe UNT and Denton have it figured out and we are just wrong on this board for thinking college football and college basketball should matter more than what the UNT Leaders and the citizenry of Denton believe. Its just hard when you grow up in Texas, where football is king of all outside activities (not just sports, but everything), and every other college around you thinks that the sport is the best way to show pride in your school. My favorite putdown, of the many I ever heard from co-workers and buddies, about UNT has always been, "Man, if we had to play yall in a marching band competition or in an art exhibit, yall would kick our ass!!" It is so easy to see why UNT students and alums who care about college sports love Texas, A&M, OU, Tech, Baylor, TCU, SMU, etc...as their "team". We don't even try to act like sports matter here beyond the bare minimum. Always has been this way, always will be this way. Dan McCarney cannot change this, nor can Tony Benford, nor RV, nor can any of us on gmg.com. Unless you get a BOR and Chancellor and President who think that athletics should trump everything else outside of academics here, you won't see any changes. The town doesn't want it, the faculty doesn't want it, and a large majority of students and alumni don't want it. To me, the only way you have any chance at changing this thought (culture) is to win something huge. The HoD Bowl was very nice, but it was still small compared to what I am talking about. Its winning a conference championship and getting into a New Years Day Bowl and winning it, while the P5s still allow it. Or winning a playoff system when the G5s and FCS are forced to combine into their own division. Or, even more possible with the right coach in hoops (which isn't Benford, even if he gets an extension soon), a deep run in the NCAA tournament. Maybe that isn't even enough to overcome this thought that athletics should never trump music and arts as THE window to the university, but its the one thing we have never done here to see if it would work. All I know is that there are a lot of the local citizenry, students, faculty, and administration who wish that their areas of academia had received some portion of the $78 million that got put into Apogee--eventually that bitterness is going to come home to roost on the BOR and Chancellor who allowed it to happen on their watch, and those voices are gonna make damn sure that nothing like that will ever get approved again by the folks who are future BOR and administrators here.

I just don't understand how you can take the time away from your family to go watch us play some FCS school in Denton. I really don't have that kind of time with three small children and all that they have going on. Now, if this was Kansas or Colorado, hell even Colorado State or Texas State, I'd figure out a way. But if the AD is so lazy to only have us play for big paychecks on the road at P5 powers and then gives us FCS schools that provide no value other than a bought win in front of 10k real butts-in-seats, I have no interest in going. I never went to games against Texas Southern, South Alabama, or Nicholls State, nor will I ever attend a game against Portland State or Incarnate Word. Now, if it was SFA, SHSU, or an FCS team who would travel and give you a good game, like NDSU or Montana, that would at least get my interest to go. But these others are absolutely terrible--they provide you with no real gauge on where you are as a team (see Texas Southern and Nicholls State), they bring nobody to Denton, and even worse, they don't give UNT students, alums, or fans any reason to give up your money and time to watch a glorified scrimmage. If we don't like it when we play at P5 giant on the road for money, we shouldn't want a FCS nobody to buy and beat the crap out of, either. At a school like ours, we are better off having five home games with one OOC game being a G5 or P5 school at home and three on the road, if necessary. Sorry, six home games (or in this case, 5 home games, with an "alternative" home game) isn't ever going to draw back the folks we are always griping about. The general college football fan, which is 98% of the UNT fanbase, would rather stay home and watch their favorite T-shirt school on TV or at their stadium than watch us play a team that couldn't beat Allen HS.

Don't get me wrong--I agree with you. But its pretty much the way it will go, if the following happens this weekend; TCU and Baylor win in the less than stellar fashion (especially Baylor) and Ohio State (somehow) clobbers Wisconsin, which I don't see happening at all right now. But again, Ohio State is college football royalty--the NCAA is gonna do all they can to make sure they get included in their new playoff. TCU is really their biggest competition here, as the committee has made it abundantly clear that they don't like Baylor's OOC schedule at all, and TCU's victory over Minnesota is better than Ohio State's victory over the Gophers. In the end, the NCAA might get their out on this, since Ohio State's QB is out for this game and Wisconsin has been playing real well. But if its all equal, Ohio State's advantages are gonna be weighed real hard against TCU.

Army is a home game in 2017, I believe...

You're learning...

5-year contracts are the price to play poker these days at the FBS level--for the most part. The price of poker at most places includes buying out more than two years if needed, but not here, lathough I do admit that Dickey's two-year buyout apparently is the reason we had to hire from a high school instead of paying up to get Jim Harbaugh, who laughed at the fact we could even get in the $400k range. Of course, Harbaugh got hired at Stanford that off-season, so he was probably just using UNT for interview experience and leverage. But since I have followed UNT, CorkyNelson got fired in his contract year, Jimmie Gales got fired in his contract season, Dennis Parker got fired after his last season on contract, Matt Simon got fired with one year left on his contract, Jankovich resigned, Trilli got fired with a year left on his contract, Dodge got fired with a year left on his contract, Johnny Jones left for LSU, and Benford has kept his job with two awful years behind him and three years left on his contract, of which he has at least two years left to go, bare minimum. And, just in case, you wondered, Tina Slinker stayed here for 19 years as the womens coach, with a record of 241-287 and exactly two postseason berths, the NWIT in 2001 and 2002, which featured two immediate losses. She was finally let go when her contract expired in 2007...

In the last four years at decrepit, toilet-bowl Fouts, we played Kansas State, Rice, Army, Ohio, Tulsa, and Navy... $78 million dollars

This. Its almost as if we are a team full of Rudy's... I just cannot see any way we win more than 4 games next year--and I think that is being extremely generous. I really see 3-9 as reasonable. This is really just like the last few years of the Dickey monster--a team that just fell off the cliff, talent-wise and never recovered. I swear if Chico goes after SilverEagle in the stands, and doesn't even get reprimanded, I'm going to Vegas to bet on Florida to win both the football and basketball championships that follow...2006 dejavu...

Since 2012, we have hosted these teams for our fanbase to come and watch: Texas Southern, Troy, Louisiana-Lafayatte, Arkansas State, South Alabama, Idaho, Ball State, Middle Tennessee, Rice, UTEP, UTSA, SMU, Louisiana Tech, Nicholls State, Southern Miss, Florida Atlantic, and Florida International. Now, for 2015, let's add Portland State to this illustrious list. If we get Old Dominion or Charlotte next year as a home game in conference play, that would just be the mayo on the cr@p sandwich we are being served. But at least we have kick-ass tailgating...

I realize that you guys are doing very well in the SBC, but your fellow teams are ULL, ULM, Texas State, Troy, South Alabama, Georgia Southern, Georgia State, Appy State, New Mexico State, and Idaho. Since you do have no competition for fan interest, imagine what it would like if your division mates in CUSA West were La Tech, Southern Miss, UTEP, UTSA, UNT, and Rice. You cannot tell me that wouldn't be worth the jump for the costs, from an attendanace standpoint, to outreach of alumni in DFW, Austin-San Antonio, Houston, and Shreveport. With your game against Memphis every year, which is a very nice series to have for your alumni and fans, you'd make up that difference sooner than you think, in my opinion. And I'd argue that you guys bring an entire state and Memphis as potential markets to pull from, versus UAB's place in Birmingham, which was almost nil. Just my opinion--but I think if you got the invite, you should jump on it, assuming the upfront costs are in line with what was previously mentioned. No one would block your entry, either, while I could see Rice, La Tech, and Southern Miss all fighting to keep ULL out. And I believe ULL would be a nice pickup for CUSA, too...

FCS is returning to us, no matter what we do. The P5s guaranteed that with their power grab earlier this year and with their conferences already mandating OOC games against other P5 schools for at least one game each year. They will be gone within 5 years, I have no doubt. Their media, legislatures, and money will make that happen. As for us, we have pretty much always been what we are now--a school that has a football team because we are in Texas and too many people were gonna bitch about losing it back in the early 80s, so we dropped down to 1-aa. We figured out a way to move up to i-a in 1995, but we weren't even ready for that at all, on any level. What will interest me the most is what kind of support a G5-FCS program will get in Denton since we will be playing current SBCUSAAC teams in conference, instead of small Texas universities at a time when the SWC was still royalty in college football. If well supported, we could do well as a program at that level. If not, a lot of old nestors are gonna get after those who ok'd the funds used on tuition and fees for a brand new football stadium...either way, it will be interesting to see.

ULM--you're on notice from the folks in Baton Rouge...monkey see, monkey do...La Tech will support LSU in every way on this, too.

Well, Dickey had one advantage, then...just trails him in wins and PR skills. They are equal in bowl wins and poor use of the QB position, from both recruiting and a playbook perspective.

I hear you, but the other side of the coin is that having UNT alumni on the BOR may very well hurt our athletics funding or direction just because of the cultural history of this place. I really can see it both ways...I do know that a BOR full of UNT alums would be a boon to the music and arts programs, though...

Ohio State has the prestige, budget, and the eyeballs that Baylor and TCU don't have...its pretty much that simple. Replace the two private schools with Texas or Oklahoma and Ohio State isn't even in the running right now.

I never questioned Mac getting an extension for what he put together last year. It was well-deserved, if for nothing else you tell the fanbase that winning will be rewarded here. However, IIRc Dickey got two-year extensions after our bowl win, not a five year extension. That is the issue here, since we know that if you don't perform well, it doesn't matter because we put the value on cost, not winning. There is zero doubt that Dan McCarney will be our head coach in 2017, unless he resigns, which would only happen because of health. Not likely... As some have posted, what football games have become at UNT is the chance to tailgate with your friends and family. Tickets are cheap and easily available. It doesn't cost an arm and a leg to attend and setup a tailgate for a full day, like it does at most other places. It is by far the smartest decision that the university (see RV) ever instituted, as you have seen attendance increase dramatically since it was instituted back in 2001 when RV got here. And I think that with Apogee having been built with this tailgating phenomenon that has grown at UNT, that has more than easily checked the box for athletics funding and promotion for these leaders. McCarney is a good coach, albeit stubborn and boring. He knows how to speak in public (unlike Dickey). He knows how to coach college football (unlike Dodge). He is better than either of them, by a long ways actually. In 4 years here, he has amassed a total record of 22-27, which is way better than his predecessors, who went in four years here 13-33 (Dickey) and Dodge (6-37), obviously. Again, to the leaders here, that is just fine with them--it shows progress, which is unarguable in their minds, especially for the increased costs of Mac and his staff, as compared to the previous two. Dickey's bad mouthing would never have gotten any major extension from the BOR, and Dodge's losses were the only reason he finally got fired in the end (since he never really bad-mouthed the school). At this point, all we can do as fans is to pray that the positive and upbeat Dan McCarney shows back up and that his pride has been damaged so much from this season that he will be singularly focused on turning this thing back around. The problem is that 2015 isn't going to be that season--we have a poor QB, a brand new OL, and a Defensive front seven that is still undersized and young. And all this is in play while we have the hardest schedule we have had in a long time here. To me, the best hope for us to be a winner again is at best 2016, since 2017 will have a schedule that is identical to 2015 (nice job on the Iowa 2 for none!!). Even with a new OC next year, the best you can really hope for with McNulty as the QB is 4-5 wins, IMO, since his line will be worse than this year from an experience perspective, and the defense will still have a lot of work to get back to the form of 2013, which is the only way you can win at UNT when you run a boring offense (see 2002-2004, and 2013). But that's best case scenario, to me. I don't see how you can expect anything better next year. We aren't going to be better than Rice, UTSA, UTEP, La Tech, USM, or UAB in division play. Maybe we get an F_U underachiever on the schedule from the East again, maybe SMU is still so bad that they cannot even beat us in our "alternative" home game, and maybe we buy another Nicholls State type of opponent to beat down. Again, I just don't see more than 4 wins in that bunch, with a real possibility of 1-2 wins again. If we only win 3 games or less, that will be the 11th time since we came back up to Division 1-A in 1995 to finish with that number of wins in a season, out of 21 years. When that is your track record, you obviously understand why its almost impossible to convince many of us who have been around here for decades to believe that we will ever demand having a winner in revenue sports from the higher ups. Instead, that demand from those folks is to have a budget maker who doesn't complain out loud. Guys like RV, Trilli, Dodge, and, so far, Benford and McCarney have been rewarded with this rule to follow. And that's why its not gonna ever change here. The people that make the hiring decisions know that the UNT Family don't want major funding to go at UNT Athletics for the cost of "winning"--they want it to be as minimal as possible so it doesn't take away from the areas of the university that are considered as the preferred window to the school. As I have pointed out several times, that may be the correct way to do it, but literally no other FBS university in Texas or in the region of the country does it this way. Your ideal alum everywhere else comes back to the university for athletics because of the many opportunities they provide. And, for me, that is why I have watched so many of my friends and fellow alums follow UT, OU, LSU, Arkansas, A&M, Tech, Baylor, TCU, and other P5 giants--this place literally told them that the area that they care about most as a supporter of the university doesn't matter here as much as you want it to, that there are other schools that offer what you want, so go follow them instead--and take your dirty, unrefined dollars with them. We don't want that kind of "support" here.

This is all so Dickey 2.0, it's not even funny...we are a MF'er rant away from DMac being the Buick again. Their game plans are identical, as is their use of the QB position. Right now, McNulty is our version of Richard Bridges, but he gets to start even more than Bridges did.

I see us winning 3 games next year--the presumed bought FCS win, then another two against the CUSA games and SMU. McNulty starts all 12 games...and our real attendance is about 14k, although it will be reported as much higher. Gotta pray that we find a better bus driver for 2016, not to mention a defense that can actually stop someone besides the offensive juggernauts that were SMU, F_Us, and Nicholls State.

FFR, what is the area that does bother you the most? I bet we all feel the same way...for me, it's the fact that we just don't care about winning here. Never has, apparently never will...

That play just described our whole season in one instance...

What a give up call, Mac

He's gone, no matter what...DW knew it was clear that Mac didn't want him around anymore. I'm sure Mac told him McNulty is the starter next year, no matter what....

That should do it--McNulty looks he can barely move and the blitz is coming every down now.

How in the world did Marshall not get that fumble?

We heard all of the same things when they hired their last "best assistant coach in the land", which was Phil Bennett. He had Texas ties, he was a great DC, and he was gonna resurrect the Hilltop...then promptly got fired after going 1-11 and never went to a bowl game. I'm not too worried about SMU being relevant ever again in football. Their day had passed. I'm more worries about La Tech, Rice, UTSA, and USM than I am the Ponies and their dozens of fans...