Seth Support

[El Paso Eagle]

6 minutes ago, TheColonyEagle said:

Deion is 23-5 as a head coach. Would that not have more to do with it?

He has done a great job getting talent and has a P5 level QB. He also has played against absolutely terrible teams. When he play average teams he doesn't do too well.This is why I think it doesn't matter who we play in OOC - please for the most part don't care as long as the perception (aka wins) or another example - the credit Seth getting for the Bowl games.

[MGNation92]

1 hour ago, Cr1028 said:

What info?

2 hours ago, Pellom said:

I subscribe to the Split Zone Duo Patreon so that entitles me to a couple of subscriber only podcasts per week. 
 

Steven Godfrey (the author of the initial post this thread is based on) and Richard Johnson (SEC Network and Sports Illustrated) are cohosts. 
 

1) Godfrey starts his report on UNT by saying he assumed Littrell would be safe after drubbing WKU. Per his sources, that is not the case and they expect Littrell will be terminated at the end of the season regardless of outcome. Winning the CUSA championship might change the calculus, but he said it would likely mean Littrell gets a P5 job and would not likely be fired from UNT. Those are semantics - the end result is the same: new coach for UNT next year. 
 

2) Godfrey’s sources inside the administration at North Texas continue to say they expect to be at the top of the G5 landscape and competing for New Year’s 6 bowl games. He said the model is the University of Houston and UNT expects to fill the gap they leave from jumping to the Big 12. (He goes on to talk about how this sounds unrealistic from UNT’s brass, which can be debated, but what’s not up for debate is expectations have risen.) 

3) Both Godfrey and Johnson say, when they talk to coaches about which G5 jobs are the MOST attractive, the North Texas job is always near the top of the list. We have money and we are signaling to the coaching community that we are ready to spend it. 

 

 

[GMG_Dallas]

37 minutes ago, MGNation92 said:

 

 

Your post above makes me want to run through a wall. Not because of the SL stuff but everything that follows. The expectations, the job appeal, and everything else in there. Hopefully it's all true.

[MGNation92]

49 minutes ago, GMG_Dallas said:

Your post above makes me want to run through a wall. Not because of the SL stuff but everything that follows. The expectations, the job appeal, and everything else in there. Hopefully it's all true.

I agree wholeheartedly. Seth is a fine coach. Not great, not terrible. He's .500 for a reason, which to some, is acceptable.

If we're going to become the next Houston? We're gonna need better than fine. Houston has routinely fired head coaches after 8-4 or 9-3 seasons because the expectation is 10+ wins and a major bowl birth EVERY YEAR . We need to be on that same level. 

Other sports are there. McCasland is incredible, Hedlund is incredible, DeLong is incredible, and Jalie is getting there. Track and Tennis are consistently good. Volleyball under Palileo was very good (jury's out on the new head coach).

One glaring piece of the puzzle we still lack? An incredible football coach. Find one and we're in business

[Cr1028]

11 minutes ago, MGNation92 said:

If we're going to become the next Houston? We're gonna need better than fine. Houston has routinely fired head coaches after 8-4 or 9-3 seasons because the expectation is 10+ wins and a major bowl birth EVERY YEAR . We need to be on that same level. 

When do you expect the announcement of Dana’s firing?

[Cr1028]

12 minutes ago, MGNation92 said:

I agree wholeheartedly. Seth is a fine coach. Not great, not terrible. He's .500 for a reason, which to some, is acceptable.

I would agree with this if we were talking about a Dan McCarney. We are talking about a first time head coach that showed up with a dynamite staff that impressed everyone in the country. Once that initial staff was poached by all the P5’s he struggled for a few years getting the right staff mix to be successful again. We are close, really close. 

[MGNation92]

4 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

When do you expect the announcement of Dana’s firing?

Based on their track record? Probably the end of the season. He might get another year after what he did in 2021. Most Houston fans I've seen are ready to get rid of him. Mainly because they actually have high expectations, unlike the majority of our fanbase.

1 minute ago, Cr1028 said:

I would agree with this if we were talking about a Dan McCarney. We are talking about a first time head coach that showed up with a dynamite staff that impressed everyone in the country. Once that initial staff was poached by all the P5’s he struggled for a few years getting the right staff mix to be successful again. We are close, really close. 

Something about horseshoes and hand grenades

[NTPoonKing]

My 2 cents:

Seth is a good coach-not great , but certainly not bad.  I'd say his demeanor could use some work, but it is what is is.  Fan/Alumni apathy is very high(nothing new).  Enthusiasm around the program is usually pretty low.  He has been here for several years and maybe its just time to start fresh.  Nothing against the man personally. The players seem to like him.

He beats the bad teams and occasionally beats a pretty good team, but getting our asses kicked by SMU every year now is getting so old. The bowl games have been pretty bad as well.  At least be more competitive. Hit the portal much harder maybe?  It's time we raise our expectations, even just a little bit....

 

This might sound over simplified, but if we could just beat SMU occasionally, local alumni(casual fans) would take more interest in the program and maybe we could move forward with more alumni support/donations/ticket sales.  Those of us who read this board and follow the team closely are always going to support the team.  But if we could just engage/tap into some of the thousands of local alumni, I think that could carry us to a higher level of enthusiasm and recognition.

[Cr1028]

9 minutes ago, MGNation92 said:

Based on their track record? Probably the end of the season. He might get another year after what he did in 2021. Most Houston fans I've seen are ready to get rid of him. Mainly because they actually have high expectations, unlike the majority of our fanbase.

Probably because the last time they had double digit losses was the same season Dickey won his first conference title, 21 years ago.

We had one the year before this first-time head coach arrived, just 7 years ago. 

When Harrell, Choice, Koonz, and John David Baker all left in the same offseason SL had a big dropoff but he has had a better record than the year before every season he has been here except for the ‘18-‘19 drop.

[MGNation92]

7 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

Probably because the last time they had double digit losses was the same season Dickey won his first conference title, 21 years ago.

We had one the year before this first-time head coach arrived, just 7 years ago. 

When Harrell, Choice, Koonz, and John David Baker all left in the same offseason SL had a big dropoff but he has had a better record than the year before every season he has been here except for the ‘18-‘19 drop.

Not including this year, 4 of his 6 completed seasons have had a losing record. He's never won a bowl or a conference championship.

I get you're a Littrell apologist but holy crap dude. Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Its year 7, we know how this ends. Littrell will beat up bad teams, and then get rolled over in the games that matter

[MeanGreenTexan]

12 minutes ago, Cr1028 said:

Probably because the last time they had double digit losses was the same season Dickey won his first conference title, 21 years ago.

We had one the year before this first-time head coach arrived, just 7 years ago. 

When Harrell, Choice, Koonz, and John David Baker all left in the same offseason SL had a big dropoff but he has had a better record than the year before every season he has been here except for the ‘18-‘19 drop.

What happens when Bennett re-retires after this season and Bloesch gets a call he can't pass up?  And Clements likely gets another look somewhere as well.   Do we have to suffer through another 2-3 years of him fumbling around trying to find the right guys again?

[KingDL1]

6 hours ago, PlummMeanGreen said:

 Begging’ some fellow Cowboy fans pardons, but charismatic is not a word that I ever heard Tom Landry described as. 
Hot shot coaches come & go.  Many fizzle out once the players learn their game & charade. 
Landry stayed a long time. Others similar did to. Coach Bill Belichick seems a grumpy old man to me, but he has more damn super bowl rings than anyone. 

GMG!

Jim, I think that is a bit apples and oranges the Cowboys did not need support from from a head coach to be popular. North Texas doesn't have the fanbase to endure a coach with a personality like Seth. I went to church with Landry and he was a pretty good speaker. 

[UNTLifer]

4 minutes ago, MGNation92 said:

Littrell apologist

I guess it is a sign of the times we live in, but why does everyone feel the need to apply some condescending term to those that share a differing opinion?

[MGNation92]

3 minutes ago, UNTLifer said:

I guess it is a sign of the times we live in, but why does everyone feel the need to apply some condescending term to those that share a differing opinion?

Definition of apologist

: someone who speaks or writes in defense of someone or something that is typically controversial, unpopular, or subject to criticism

 

Condescending? Hardly.

 

Littrell is a .500 coach. Plenty of posters on here are defending him despite this. He's not a bad coach, but if we want to raise our expectations, we have to do better than "not bad".

 

 

 

[UNT Texas Hooligan]

2 hours ago, MGNation92 said:

I subscribe to the Split Zone Duo Patreon so that entitles me to a couple of subscriber only podcasts per week. 
 

Steven Godfrey (the author of the initial post this thread is based on) and Richard Johnson (SEC Network and Sports Illustrated) are cohosts. 
 

1) Godfrey starts his report on UNT by saying he assumed Littrell would be safe after drubbing WKU. Per his sources, that is not the case and they expect Littrell will be terminated at the end of the season regardless of outcome. Winning the CUSA championship might change the calculus, but he said it would likely mean Littrell gets a P5 job and would not likely be fired from UNT. Those are semantics - the end result is the same: new coach for UNT next year. 
 

2) Godfrey’s sources inside the administration at North Texas continue to say they expect to be at the top of the G5 landscape and competing for New Year’s 6 bowl games. He said the model is the University of Houston and UNT expects to fill the gap they leave from jumping to the Big 12. (He goes on to talk about how this sounds unrealistic from UNT’s brass, which can be debated, but what’s not up for debate is expectations have risen.) 

3) Both Godfrey and Johnson say, when they talk to coaches about which G5 jobs are the MOST attractive, the North Texas job is always near the top of the list. We have money and we are signaling to the coaching community that we are ready to spend it.

Now I'm even more fired up about this season, IF this is all true. This was never about Littrell, I don't dislike him. I just want us to win, whether that is with or without him. We know what we get from him, so a change could do us really well. Dream scenario is Seth goes on to win the conference title, gets hired away to a P5, and we start the American with a new coach with new ideas. Tired of being satisfied with average, and we all need to be if we want to be one of those Top G5 programs. I would love for us to fill that UH gap when they jump to the Big 12. That was always a good model for us. 

[UNTLifer]

I guess there are choices.  One could call them Seth Supporters instead of Apologists.  One conjures up a more positive image than the other.  Whatever...carry on.

[MGNation92]

10 minutes ago, UNT Texas Hooligan said:

Now I'm even more fired up about this season, IF this is all true. This was never about Littrell, I don't dislike him. I just want us to win, whether that is with or without him. We know what we get from him, so a change could do us really well. Dream scenario is Seth goes on to win the conference title, gets hired away to a P5, and we start the American with a new coach with new ideas. Tired of being satisfied with average, and we all need to be if we want to be one of those Top G5 programs. I would love for us to fill that UH gap when they jump to the Big 12. That was always a good model for us. 

Hell I was beating the Seth drum just as loudly as anyone else in 2017-18. After 3 consecutive losing seasons, it's pretty clear where our program is with him. If he was winning 8-10 games a year I'd be ecstatic, but he's not. I want UNT to be successful, and I don't think he can get us there. I'd love to be proved wrong

[UNTcrazy727]

 

17 minutes ago, UNT Texas Hooligan said:

Now I'm even more fired up about this season, IF this is all true. This was never about Littrell, I don't dislike him. I just want us to win, whether that is with or without him. We know what we get from him, so a change could do us really well. Dream scenario is Seth goes on to win the conference title, gets hired away to a P5, and we start the American with a new coach with new ideas. Tired of being satisfied with average, and we all need to be if we want to be one of those Top G5 programs. I would love for us to fill that UH gap when they jump to the Big 12. That was always a good model for us. 

We're better off losing a coach that just won 8 or more games and a conference championship? Hard disagree. 

I don't buy this report. I always figured Littrell needed a really good year to see 2023, but to suggest 8+ wins and a conference championship isn't good enough is far-fetched. If that's the case why did Baker, Smatresk, and our top donors waste everyone's time by brining him back this year?

[UNT Texas Hooligan]

3 minutes ago, UNTcrazy727 said:

 

We're better off losing a coach that just won 8 or more games and a conference championship? Hard disagree. 

I don't buy this report. I always figured Littrell needed a really good year to see 2023, but to suggest 8+ wins and a conference championship isn't good enough is far-fetched. If that's the case why did Baker, Smatresk, and our top donors waste everyone's time by brining him back this year?

So after seeing what happened to us in the Memphis and SMU games and seeing where those 2 teams currently are in the standings in the AAC, you think Littrell is American quality?

[TheColonyEagle]

13 minutes ago, UNTcrazy727 said:

We're better off losing a coach that just won 8 or more games and a conference championship? Hard disagree. 

I don't buy this report. I always figured Littrell needed a really good year to see 2023, but to suggest 8+ wins and a conference championship isn't good enough is far-fetched.

That depends on how you view UNT Football. If you think it's "far-fetched" to move on from a .500 coach that's been here for 7 years, then you don't see UNT Football as a program that should be winning 10+ games and competing for NY6 Bowls. There are LOADS of people that think like that by the way....fine. But the amount we're paying for a HC would suggest that 8 wins and a conference championship every 7 years isn't good enough. If it is...then quit wasting everyone's time and get someone cheaper in here and focus on basketball...

[GMG_Dallas]

2 hours ago, MGNation92 said:

Based on their track record? Probably the end of the season. He might get another year after what he did in 2021. Most Houston fans I've seen are ready to get rid of him. Mainly because they actually have high expectations, unlike the majority of our fanbase.

It's easy for Houston fans to want to get rid of Holgerson, or whoever else they get next, when you've got a sports crazed billionaire signing the checks. It's also easy when it's not your money. I'm sure UNT has some fans with deep pockets but Fertitta is on another level.

I read that Auburn is paying $36 million in head coach buyouts between Malzahn and this recently fired coach. That's a lot of coin being spent on a position that's currently vacant. Having a higher expectations comes at a cost. It's important to remember that.

Edited November 3, 2022 by GMG_Dallas

[Cr1028]

1 hour ago, MGNation92 said:

Not including this year, 4 of his 6 completed seasons have had a losing record. He's never won a bowl or a conference championship.

I get you're a Littrell apologist but holy crap dude. Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Its year 7, we know how this ends. Littrell will beat up bad teams, and then get rolled over in the games that matter

 

[NT80]

6 hours ago, MGNation92 said:

I agree wholeheartedly. Seth is a fine coach. Not great, not terrible. He's .500 for a reason, which to some, is acceptable.

If we're going to become the next Houston? We're gonna need better than fine. Houston has routinely fired head coaches after 8-4 or 9-3 seasons because the expectation is 10+ wins and a major bowl birth EVERY YEAR . We need to be on that same level. 

Other sports are there. McCasland is incredible, Hedlund is incredible, DeLong is incredible, and Jalie is getting there. Track and Tennis are consistently good. Volleyball under Palileo was very good (jury's out on the new head coach).

One glaring piece of the puzzle we still lack? An incredible football coach. Find one and we're in business

Wren has not hired a Football HC since he has been AD.  

It would be a keystone hire for this program, and for Wren's career to this point!

Wren can do better than overseeing a football program moving to the AAC stuck on .500

[NT80]

3 hours ago, Cr1028 said:

 

Without looking them up, I doubt those 10 CUSA teams had an overall winning record.

[Cr1028]

12 minutes ago, NT80 said:

Without looking them up, I doubt those 10 CUSA teams had an overall winning record.

As of right now, 4 of them did or do.