Minimum number of wins for consideration

[untjim1995]

19 minutes ago, MGNation92 said:

UTSA's program didn't exist 15 years ago and they won 11 and the conference title last year.

What's Seth's excuse?

I hear this argument alot, but UTSA was starting from scratch in one of the biggest cities in the country, one which doesn't have another FBS school in the market. They have a nice sized stadium and a tourist attraction to get well-known teams to come there and recruits don't have any baggage to hear about the program. They have a lot of media basically to themselves and a citizenry that takes a lot of pride in their city. Its like a bigger version of Ft. Worth, but without a big city to share media with. And they have momentum with a very good coach and a conference championship under their belt.

Contrast that with North Texas and Denton. Denton either doesn't care or loathes our existence. We don't even get mentioned by DFW media 95% of the time and when we do, we usually wish we weren't getting mentioned (i.e, SMU losses, let's go see UNT play, etc...). Recruits hear nothing but how we don't care about winning or that we don't have any school pride. We think playing SMU is a huge game...in our 30k stadium that we've never sold out. And we've haven't won a conference since 2004, when we were the king of the spares in the SBC.

[Monkeypox]

10 minutes ago, UNTcrazy727 said:

It's insane to tell a coach he has to do something that's never been done in program history in order to keep his job. If you think that's fair then we'll just have to agree to disagree. 

Wait, it's insane to ask your coach to make you better than you were before he got there? So the only bar we should ever have is bad to mediocre because our program is historically craptastic?

Sorry, but I don't think you're going to grow a program if the goal is a .500 record, rare (or no) conference championships, rare (or no) bowl wins.

Yeah, that's our history, and our history is garbage.

Edited September 29, 2022 by Monkeypox

[UNTcrazy727]

27 minutes ago, Monkeypox said:

Wait, it's insane to ask your coach to make you better than you were before he got there? So the only bar we should ever have is bad to mediocre because our program is historically craptastic?

Sorry, but I don't think you're going to grow a program if the goal is a .500 record, rare (or no) conference championships, rare (or no) bowl wins.

Yeah, that's our history, and our history is garbage.

What are you saying? If we don't win 10 games then we're mediocre garbage? There's a MASSIVE difference between .500 and 10 wins. When did we suddenly become a program that's too good to accept 8-9 win seasons?

Edited September 29, 2022 by UNTcrazy727

[MGNation92]

26 minutes ago, UNTcrazy727 said:

It's insane to tell a coach he has to do something that's never been done in program history in order to keep his job. If you think that's fair then we'll just have to agree to disagree. 

He's in his seventh year with two 9 win seasons under his belt.

After 3 years of mediocrity, it's time to nut up or shut up. Were those 9 win seasons just a mirage created by Mason Fine and Graham Harrell? or are you a good enough coach to do it again?

To be fair I wanted him fired last year, so there's pretty much nothing he could do that could change my mind. 10 wins and a conference championship/bowl win would be about the only thing to move the needle for me.

 

[greenminer]

3 hours ago, MrAlien said:

No need to fire him mid season, but you can let him know that he is not coming back, and begin looking for a replacement.  The foundation needs to be in place for next season the day after the current season is over, because thats when transfers and recruits really start paying attention. 

More antiquated views that have been debunked.

Pay attention.  The portal and new xfer rules have changed EVERYTHING.

[Monkeypox]

2 hours ago, UNTcrazy727 said:

What are you saying? If we don't win 10 games then we're mediocre garbage? There's a MASSIVE difference between .500 and 10 wins. When did we suddenly become a program that's too good to accept 8-9 win seasons?

No, I'm saying if SETH LITTRELL doesn't win 10 games this season, then HE is mediocre garbage, as that is the question asked in the thread. 

For THIS coach, who got blown out by SMU again, blown out by UNLV, was pleased to be on the same field with Memphis, that he has to do the things he's never done to prove he's NOT mediocre. He's already had 3 chances not to fail in that criteria this year... and he failed.

I've seen UNT win 9 games in a handful of seasons over my lifetime. I've seen UNT lose to SMU like 80-90% of the time. I've seen us lose to pretty much every OOC FBS team since I went to school here in the 90s. I've seen us lose the vast majority of bowl games. I've seen us win few (and Seth NONE) conference championships. 

So for SETH LITTRELL, my bar is not 8-9 games, because I consider that an easy hurdle given the resources this program has (resources we didn't have for most of our history) and given the garbage conference we play in, and given the time he's been in charge of it. He would get more slack if he hadn't laid an egg vs SMU, UNLV, and Memphis. But that's what he did because that's what he is. 

As for the difference between .500 and 10 wins, it's not that much when it comes to SL.

If he wins out, he goes 9-3 and then loses the championship game and bowl game (as is his standard), to 9-5. This makes him 46-42, or .522 for his career... 4 games over .500 with 5 wins against OOC FBS teams in 7 years.

If he goes 6-1 the rest of the way, and loses a bowl game (assuming someone else goes undefeated in conference or we lose to the other 1-loss team), then he's 8-5... 45-43 for his career.

If Seth does what I'm saying I'd need him to do, he'd go 11-3. This would make him 48-41, with a single championship and a single bowl win for his career. Certainly not shooting for the moon.

[MeanGreen4Life1998]

Gotta be 10 wins, Conference Championship appearance that is, at worst, competitive and a bowl win. 
 

But that sure as hell isn’t happening

[Pseudo Nym]

40 minutes ago, Monkeypox said:

No, I'm saying if SETH LITTRELL doesn't win 10 games this season, then HE is mediocre garbage, as that is the question asked in the thread. 

For THIS coach, who got blown out by SMU again, blown out by UNLV, was pleased to be on the same field with Memphis, that he has to do the things he's never done to prove he's NOT mediocre. He's already had 3 chances not to fail in that criteria this year... and he failed.

I've seen UNT win 9 games in a handful of seasons over my lifetime. I've seen UNT lose to SMU like 80-90% of the time. I've seen us lose to pretty much every OOC FBS team since I went to school here in the 90s. I've seen us lose the vast majority of bowl games. I've seen us win few (and Seth NONE) conference championships. 

So for SETH LITTRELL, my bar is not 8-9 games, because I consider that an easy hurdle given the resources this program has (resources we didn't have for most of our history) and given the garbage conference we play in, and given the time he's been in charge of it. He would get more slack if he hadn't laid an egg vs SMU, UNLV, and Memphis. But that's what he did because that's what he is. 

As for the difference between .500 and 10 wins, it's not that much when it comes to SL.

If he wins out, he goes 9-3 and then loses the championship game and bowl game (as is his standard), to 9-5. This makes him 46-42, or .522 for his career... 4 games over .500 with 5 wins against OOC FBS teams in 7 years.

If he goes 6-1 the rest of the way, and loses a bowl game (assuming someone else goes undefeated in conference or we lose to the other 1-loss team), then he's 8-5... 45-43 for his career.

If Seth does what I'm saying I'd need him to do, he'd go 11-3. This would make him 48-41, with a single championship and a single bowl win for his career. Certainly not shooting for the moon.

The levels I felt reading this post:

And because one was not enough for this brilliant take!

Edited September 29, 2022 by Pseudo Nym

[UNTcrazy727]

39 minutes ago, Monkeypox said:

No, I'm saying if SETH LITTRELL doesn't win 10 games this season, then HE is mediocre garbage, as that is the question asked in the thread. 

For THIS coach, who got blown out by SMU again, blown out by UNLV, was pleased to be on the same field with Memphis, that he has to do the things he's never done to prove he's NOT mediocre. He's already had 3 chances not to fail in that criteria this year... and he failed.

I've seen UNT win 9 games in a handful of seasons over my lifetime. I've seen UNT lose to SMU like 80-90% of the time. I've seen us lose to pretty much every OOC FBS team since I went to school here in the 90s. I've seen us lose the vast majority of bowl games. I've seen us win few (and Seth NONE) conference championships. 

So for SETH LITTRELL, my bar is not 8-9 games, because I consider that an easy hurdle given the resources this program has (resources we didn't have for most of our history) and given the garbage conference we play in, and given the time he's been in charge of it. He would get more slack if he hadn't laid an egg vs SMU, UNLV, and Memphis. But that's what he did because that's what he is. 

As for the difference between .500 and 10 wins, it's not that much when it comes to SL.

If he wins out, he goes 9-3 and then loses the championship game and bowl game (as is his standard), to 9-5. This makes him 46-42, or .522 for his career... 4 games over .500 with 5 wins against OOC FBS teams in 7 years.

If he goes 6-1 the rest of the way, and loses a bowl game (assuming someone else goes undefeated in conference or we lose to the other 1-loss team), then he's 8-5... 45-43 for his career.

If Seth does what I'm saying I'd need him to do, he'd go 11-3. This would make him 48-41, with a single championship and a single bowl win for his career. Certainly not shooting for the moon.

Just say he can’t do anything in your eyes to be brought back because saying a coach has to win 11 games is laughable. 

[Monkeypox]

1 hour ago, UNTcrazy727 said:

Just say he can’t do anything in your eyes to be brought back because saying a coach has to win 11 games is laughable. 

Saying a coach can't possibly win 11 games tells me you don't think he's a very good coach.

But I think that's a fair take. It's laughable for SL to win the conference and a bowl game, which tells you everything you need to know about him.

Edited September 30, 2022 by Monkeypox

[UNTcrazy727]

7 minutes ago, Monkeypox said:

Saying a coach can't possibly win 11 games tells me you don't think he's a very good coach.

But I think that's a fair take. It's laughable for SL to win the conference and a bowl game, which tells you everything you need to know about him.

Never said he couldn’t win that many games. Just saying making it a requirement for a coach to keep their job is beyond unfair. Especially, for a program like ours. A program that hasn’t even been ranked since 1959. 

[Monkeypox]

Just now, UNTcrazy727 said:

Never said he couldn’t win that many games. Just saying making it a requirement for a coach to keep their job is beyond unfair. Especially, for a program like ours. A program that hasn’t even been ranked since 1959. 

He's had plenty of time. He needs to do something new. Either win meaningful games here or go steal some other school's money.

[Cr1028]

11 minutes ago, Monkeypox said:

Saying a coach can't possibly win 11 games tells me you don't think he's a very good coach.

The next UNT coach to win 11 games will be the first.

[Monkeypox]

1 minute ago, Cr1028 said:

The next UNT coach to win 11 games will be the first.

I know... imagine wanting UNT to not suck at football.