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DRC Sunday column: Guiding UNT to bowl shows why Seth Littrell is great fit with Mean Green


Brett Vito
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12 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

That simply cannot happen unless he gets back to his previous 9-win expectations next season.   Even then, it’s gotta be like 2-3 years only (but I doubt Sexton goes for that).

If you look at the AAC head coaching salaries that are staying, Seth’s current comp is in line. If he goes to lower P5 like a Kansas he makes $1m more. If he wins and stays a small bump in pay with incentives would work. Salary pool is the big deal for today’s coaches.

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9 minutes ago, texx2818 said:

I follow UNT because I enjoy the games and it’s a fun small community of fans. I have given up on us ever becoming “the next UCF”. 

My Vito prediction was like 1-11, so I guess this season was a success. I don’t get my blood pressure up over UNT games anymore.

Guess I’m #OldDenton.

Never Give Up Good Luck GIF

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3 minutes ago, Wag Tag said:

If you look at the AAC head coaching salaries that are staying, Seth’s current comp is in line. If he goes to lower P5 like a Kansas he makes $1m more. If he wins and stays a small bump in pay with incentives would work. Salary pool is the big deal for today’s coaches.

Right.   I’m just saying, with Littrell’s agent, an extension starts at 5 years & only goes UP from there.

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1 hour ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Bloesch was able to rebuild Langstons mess quickly.  He proved to be a nice hire himself.  Not sure what all went into giving him the OC job, but if he got stripped of that, I dunno if he’d stick around, so yeah, we’d have to replace him too.  I’d hate to lose him.  That’s a lot of turnover on that side of the ball, so we may have to reinvent ourselves offensively again.   But it could be even better, especially if Littrell hit on both hires (OC & OL).

Bloesch has been an awesome offensive line coach, and extremely beneficial for our run game and pass protection. What went into the additional OC job title were MAJOR P5 programs wanting to hire him away for 2X - 3X his pay at UNT. So UNT adds a title of OC to him, and raises his pay for retention. Hopefully we are able to retain him for another year, and continue to develop a group of young and talented offensive linemen. 

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13 hours ago, Side.Show.Joe said:

What you have presented is not a good analogy to our situation. Littrell is not a cog in the machine, like your employees. The head coach is the motor that drives them. When he fails it all fails. When he succeeds it all works... like McCasland.

Cog or motor, you don't change something that appears to be working very well.

If we blow out Miami, there is reason to believe we can win 7-8 games next year.  Even more if we figure out QB play.
If it is close, or we get blown out, red flags are up again and the leash in 2022 is very short.  I would be okay in this scenario if Baker fires him after this kind of bowl loss.

I wanted him fired when we were 1-6.  At that point, I would have agreed he should have been fired.  But here we are.  The winning streak just saved his job, and gives me hope for 2022.

Edited by greenminer
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9 hours ago, greenminer said:

Cog or motor, you don't change something that appears to be working very well.

If we blow out Miami, there is reason to believe we can win 7-8 games next year.  Even more if we figure out QB play.
If it is close, or we get blown out, red flags are up again and the leash in 2022 is very short.  I would be okay in this scenario if Baker fires him after this kind of bowl loss.

I wanted him fired when we were 1-6.  At that point, I would have agreed he should have been fired.  But here we are.  The winning streak just saved his job, and gives me hope for 2022.

This is where I’m at.  However, people are acting like the season is over and that the bowl game doesn’t matter.  We signed less than half a class at early signing day.  That still leaves Wren and a new coach time to adjust and bring in players that they would want.

I’m not saying that we signed half a class so we could keep SL on a short leash, but it absolutely still means we have options.  The team needs to finish the season out strong with a big win against Miami.  It helps SL close on the rest of this 22’ class, or it paves the way for change.

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22 hours ago, Cr1028 said:

You can rebuild a basketball team in a season because you can get away with having a few great players. Football is not easy to turn around in a short period of time because you need depth. McCasland and Littrell are faced with very different sports and circumstances. Johnny Jones has shown you can win at North Texas and McCasland took it to a step above what Jones did. Littrell is the first one to put a .500 or above record together here in football in 40 years.

I would agree we have more depth now than we've ever had and he built that depth by year 4.  Agreed it takes longer, but if they would have hit the transfer portal earlier they could have built that depth authentically (See team from Dallas) then you win and begin recruiting better HS talent and use the portal less.  

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9 hours ago, greenminer said:

Cog or motor, you don't change something that appears to be working very well.

If we blow out Miami, there is reason to believe we can win 7-8 games next year.  Even more if we figure out QB play.
If it is close, or we get blown out, red flags are up again and the leash in 2022 is very short.  I would be okay in this scenario if Baker fires him after this kind of bowl loss.

I wanted him fired when we were 1-6.  At that point, I would have agreed he should have been fired.  But here we are.  The winning streak just saved his job, and gives me hope for 2022.

Seth beat 1 bad FCS Team finished ranked 216

Seth Four really bad FBS teams 

Rice in OT : 148

Southern Miss : 156

UTEP : 123

Fla. International : 194

One Over Rated Division Mate

UTSA : 53

 

So the average ranking of the teams we managed to beat this season was 148, What ranked 148,  Yes 148

Seth Sucks, a 6th year coach. He needs to get back to his golf game. 

Seth deserves nothing

https://sagarin.usatoday.com/2021-2/college-football-team-ratings-2021/

 

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18 hours ago, greenminer said:

Cog or motor, you don't change something that appears to be working very well.

If we blow out Miami, there is reason to believe we can win 7-8 games next year.  Even more if we figure out QB play.
If it is close, or we get blown out, red flags are up again and the leash in 2022 is very short.  I would be okay in this scenario if Baker fires him after this kind of bowl loss.

I wanted him fired when we were 1-6.  At that point, I would have agreed he should have been fired.  But here we are.  The winning streak just saved his job, and gives me hope for 2022.

6-6 and .500 after 6 seasons is not my standard for "very well".

We should blow out Miami OH. They are also a 6-6 teams with only one win over a winning team... and our Frisco Bowl is basically a home game for us.

And a 7-8 win team in C-USA next season, still wouldn't be good enough to finish better than middle of the pack in the American.

The winning streak just fooled some people around here into believing things have changed. The data proves Littrell hasn't been a successful coach in C-USA, which means there is almost no chance Seth can be a winner in the American. So there is no good reason to keep him.

Edited by Side.Show.Joe
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3 hours ago, KingDL1 said:

Seth beat 1 bad FCS Team finished ranked 216

Seth Four really bad FBS teams 

Rice in OT : 148

Southern Miss : 156

UTEP : 123

Fla. International : 194

One Over Rated Division Mate

UTSA : 53

 

So the average ranking of the teams we managed to beat this season was 148, What ranked 148,  Yes 148

Seth Sucks, a 6th year coach. He needs to get back to his golf game. 

Seth deserves nothing

https://sagarin.usatoday.com/2021-2/college-football-team-ratings-2021/

 

Be careful telling the truth around here. Old Denton isn't interested in facts. They are content with the status quo.

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13 hours ago, Side.Show.Joe said:

Be careful telling the truth around here. Old Denton isn't interested in facts. They are content with the status quo.

Yep. Get to a bowl and all is well in MG land! Seth should be canned after this season. I think it’s a must when this team heads into the AAC. 

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On 12/19/2021 at 8:16 PM, Side.Show.Joe said:

Wow... I hope Vito is just speculating about Littrell's future. I really don't want to think about this fight until after our bowl game Thursday. I'll just say Littrell isn't good enough to successfully lead UNT into the American, and anyone that is being honest with themself knows it. I hope our administration makes the right move and we can finally build a winner that contends for conference titles.

Old Denton can begin down-voting my post now. Ha!

I'm doubling down on this post. Seth is what he is. Time to fire him.

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2 minutes ago, Side.Show.Joe said:

I'm doubling down on this post. Seth is what he is. Time to fire him.

OK so say you are right and you very well may be.  What if we won’t have an adequate replacement for him?  Is it possible we wait a year for a better candidate to become available.  You are staying it like we just have to fire Seth no matter what.  

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1 minute ago, Jonnyeagle said:

OK so say you are right and you very well may be.  What if we won’t have an adequate replacement for him?  Is it possible we wait a year for a better candidate to become available.  You are staying it like we just have to fire Seth no matter what.  

There would be a line all the way around campus of better coaches ready to apply if Wren gives the word. Then again Wren may already have this lined up. 

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2 minutes ago, Jonnyeagle said:

OK so say you are right and you very well may be.  What if we won’t have an adequate replacement for him?  Is it possible we wait a year for a better candidate to become available.  You are staying it like we just have to fire Seth no matter what.  

There are better coaches out there. UNT pays near the top of the G5. We have great facilities. We are located in the 5th largest media market. And, we are moving to the American. Tons of coaches will want this job. The Miami OH coach is better than Seth and he only makes about $500k a year (not that I want him).

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57 minutes ago, Side.Show.Joe said:

Do you still believe this?

It told me what I needed to know, so yes.

Among others, you were constantly reminding me that the winning streak was against bad teams.  I knew that.  But lack of evidence (wins against good teams) is not proof for for something else (we are still a terrible team). The game planning during the win streak looked different.  The attitude was better.  I still maintain that.  I needed to see it, however, against stiffer competition. ride the win streak with SL until we know for sure.
 

5 hours ago, greenminer said:

I was never of the opinion that the win streak meant this team was great.  I just felt like it was okay to keep riding it until we face better competition.

It crossed my mind today that part of the reason our loss was so awful, is that it appeared SL went back to the old formula.  Like he abandoned what was working.  I was hoping to hear and read all the postgame analysis, to see if others think that way too.

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15 minutes ago, greenminer said:

It told me what I needed to know, so yes.

Among others, you were constantly reminding me that the winning streak was against bad teams.  I knew that.  But lack of evidence (wins against good teams) is not proof for for something else (we are still a terrible team). The game planning during the win streak looked different.  The attitude was better.  I still maintain that.  I needed to see it, however, against stiffer competition. ride the win streak with SL until we know for sure.
 

It crossed my mind today that part of the reason our loss was so awful, is that it appeared SL went back to the old formula.  Like he abandoned what was working.  I was hoping to hear and read all the postgame analysis, to see if others think that way too.

The competition really wasn't that much better. Miami OH only beat one team with a winning record this season. And worst of all....

Tonight's win over UNT broke their 30 game losing streak to OOC FBS opponents. Yes, Miami OH had not won an OOC game against an FBS team since 2011. Seth needs to go.

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On 12/22/2021 at 6:49 PM, Side.Show.Joe said:

Be careful telling the truth around here. Old Denton isn't interested in facts. They are content with the status quo.

Old Denton loves Seth. 

They donate money, get their names on the side of the IPF, grab a few dinners with him and they're happy as a pig in shit.  They'll spend the rest of their retirement years on Hub Club or Suite tix and move on to the next life when it's all done. 

As I've said before, Old Denton sees Apogee as a social circle. If the team wins 5 or wins 9, it doesn't really matter to them they're there for the buffet and socializing.  Not a single one of them will hold back money till a new coach is hired, the football program isn't that mature despite it's long history.

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1 hour ago, greenminer said:

It told me what I needed to know, so yes.

Among others, you were constantly reminding me that the winning streak was against bad teams.  I knew that.  But lack of evidence (wins against good teams) is not proof for for something else (we are still a terrible team). The game planning during the win streak looked different.  The attitude was better.  I still maintain that.  I needed to see it, however, against stiffer competition. ride the win streak with SL until we know for sure.
 

It crossed my mind today that part of the reason our loss was so awful, is that it appeared SL went back to the old formula.  Like he abandoned what was working.  I was hoping to hear and read all the postgame analysis, to see if others think that way too.

What was working was Torrey making mindblowing runs. We didn’t have that tool in the toolchest today and I’d really like to know the why. Novil has a better chance of sticking in the pros than both Torrey and Sanders yet he played.

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1 minute ago, Cr1028 said:

What was working was Torrey making mindblowing runs. We didn’t have that tool in the toolchest today and I’d really like to know the why. Novil has a better chance of sticking in the pros than both Torrey and Sanders yet he played.

Is this just the assumption (not playing to keep himself healthy for the pro day)?   Haven’t seen anything come out saying exactly why.  Poor guy has taken a beating on here, needlessly if it’s not true.

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4 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Is this just the assumption (not playing to keep himself healthy for the pro day)?   Haven’t seen anything come out saying exactly why.  Poor guy has taken a beating on here, needlessly if it’s not true.

Yea purely an assumption but the graphic put out when the bowl was announced gave the indication that he wasn’t going to be featured in the game. I feel like he got what he wanted, got a little NIL money and then got an agent. Maybe I’m way off but it sure looks that way on the surface.

Edited by Cr1028
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