Could Group of Five Teams Make up for Oklahoma and Texas Leaving for SEC?

[meangreen11]

This is the question that everyone wants to know. It’s premature to say exactly how it will play out, but bringing two or more of the current American Athletic Conference (AAC) teams into the Big 12 serves more than one purpose.

First, the Big 12 could lose more members. Kansas (Big 10), Iowa State (Big 10) and/or other schools could change conferences. Guessing which teams move around proves difficult, but it’s definitely possible and damaging to the Big 12.

Second, the broadening of the Big 12 with college football programs on the rise, as well as programs that expand the Big 12 footprint into new television markets, makes sense. Each one of Houston, Memphis, UCF, and Cincinnati have been through really good seasons lately. SMU cannot be counted out as a possible Big 12 member either.

read more:  https://news.google.com/articles/CBMiaWh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnNpLmNvbS9jb2xsZWdlL3VjZi91bml2ZXJzaXR5LW9mLWNlbnRyYWwtZmxvcmlkYS1mb290YmFsbC9jb25mZXJlbmNlLXJlYWxpZ25tZW50LWFuZC10aGUtcGFjdNIBbmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnNpLmNvbS9jb2xsZWdlL3VjZi8uYW1wL3VuaXZlcnNpdHktb2YtY2VudHJhbC1mbG9yaWRhLWZvb3RiYWxsL2NvbmZlcmVuY2UtcmVhbGlnbm1lbnQtYW5kLXRoZS1wYWN0?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US%3Aen

[emmitt01]

“Second, the broadening of the Big 12 with college football programs on the rise, as well as programs that expand the Big 12 footprint into new television markets, makes sense.”

They say this…and then mention SMU as a possibility?  
 

[wardly]

From what I have read the "left behind" in the BIG 12 bring no additional value [ code for revenue] to any other P5 conference either collectively or individuality . If fact, they are no longer considered a P5 program by the AAC,PAC 12, or BIG 10 conferences demonstrated  by their exclusion from ongoing talks among these BIG 3 regarding working together to increase their collective value to ESPN. The 8 remaining BIG 12 members seem to have no other option that to stay the course and add 2 to 4 programs. However whoever they add, [and SMU assuredly will not be invited] have even less value/revenue that its existing 8 members. If their ESPN pie will be reduced in value by 50% in 2025 with the loss of Texas and Oklahoma at least it will be split only 8 ways. The quandary The BIG 12 finds themselves in is why add members who bring no additional revenue and decreases the value of their slice of the money pie. Actually, that is the same question the BIG 10 asked and answered when they chose not to add Kansas or Iowa State. Its always been about "show me the money", but now it really is for every program that would like to change conferences, regardless of P5 or G5 status.

[GreenN'walinsVet]

If im the BIG 12 teams im doing a full court press on Arkansas, Missouri, Nebraska, and Colorado to all flip over and join the BIG 12.  They all would come in at the top and be in better competitive situations then what they are in now.

[El Paso Eagle]

Nebraska, Arkansas, and Missouri has proven the check is more important than being competitive. 

[Jonnyeagle]

For today, this article will focus solely upon how the members of the American Athletic Conference (AAC) rank in terms of Big 12 membership. The prime candidates from the AAC include, by alphabetical order: Cincinnati, Houston, Memphis, SMU, and UCF.
 

read more:  https://news.google.com/articles/CBMiZ2h0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnNpLmNvbS9jb2xsZWdlL3VjZi91bml2ZXJzaXR5LW9mLWNlbnRyYWwtZmxvcmlkYS1mb290YmFsbC9yYW5raW5nLXRoZS1hYWMtdGVhbXMtZm9yLXRoZS1iMTLSAWxodHRwczovL3d3dy5zaS5jb20vY29sbGVnZS91Y2YvLmFtcC91bml2ZXJzaXR5LW9mLWNlbnRyYWwtZmxvcmlkYS1mb290YmFsbC9yYW5raW5nLXRoZS1hYWMtdGVhbXMtZm9yLXRoZS1iMTI?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US%3Aen

[WanderingEagle]

2 hours ago, El Paso Eagle said:

Nebraska, Arkansas, and Missouri has proven the check is more important than being competitive. 

Mizzou won two SEC East titles fresh off joining the conference. They've had two losing seasons in the last decade but they have been... fine in the SEC? They're not Arkansas or Nebraska levels of disappointing right now.

[Mean Green 93-98]

11 hours ago, GreenN'walinsVet said:

If im the BIG 12 teams im doing a full court press on Arkansas, Missouri, Nebraska, and Colorado to all flip over and join the BIG 12.  They all would come in at the top and be in better competitive situations then what they are in now.

If I'm Arkansas, Missouri, Nebraska, or Colorado, why do I leave a stable situation for the most unstable conference in the country?  There may not even be a Big XII five years from now.

[wardly]

12 hours ago, GreenN'walinsVet said:

If im the BIG 12 teams im doing a full court press on Arkansas, Missouri, Nebraska, and Colorado to all flip over and join the BIG 12.  They all would come in at the top and be in better competitive situations then what they are in now.

They would be foolish to buy a ticket on the Titanic. Arkansas,Missouri, and Nebraska make a ton of money compared to what the Big 12 will have to offer after the departure on Texas and Oklahoma. While less money that the Big 10 or SEC, the PAC12 still offers Colorado more money than the diminished Big 12. This and future realignments are not based upon being competitive but about money. Your program basically has no value unless it can bring an increase in revenue to a prospective conference.

[Wag Tag]

The have nots are eventually going to have to fill their stadiums to make money. You do that with regional competition. ( UNT playing SMU example)  SWC needs to come back.

[PlummMeanGreen]

Until North Texas removes itself from this hodge-podge of schools we will eventually sink into NCAA oblivion.  Yet UNT is one of the few G5 schools that can avoid that because of (once again) our prime location in an 8,000,000 Texans populated area, our ever-expanding grade A  athletic venues (seen daily by 10’s of thousands of Interstate commuters) & who we presently have leading our university. 

Watch out! IT’S A FROG!  
🟣⚪️TCU very admirably (IMO) went rogue (leaving SMU behind in doing so) by joining the MWC when they did & even🔴⚪️Texas A&M who wanted a similar LoneStarState exclusivity by leaving UT behind & joining the SEC. That seemed to finally be working for AggieLand before UT & OU completely screwed all that up for the Ags but ——- until UNT does what some on this forum would call “the impossible dream” all this constant rearranging of Titanic deck chairs will continue & North Texas will eventually lose its unique identity while blending in with the rest of G5 chaos.  (In your 💚’s you know I am close to being right about this, so grow some ‘nads & admit it (but do keep in mind you might get the dreaded red🔻downvote for having an actual opinion that differs from the rest).

👤So just where do we go then?
Well, we have a more than capable AD at UNT who would work behind the scenes with that complex problem (& come up with a plan that would probably be beyond any of our wildest dreams). All that to get “our favorite school” out of this forever hodgepodge. A hodgepodge that a 40K plus Texas university with arguably the best damn location (where 2 Interstates meet at our freakin’ campus stadium for heaven’s sake)😎 in the South or Southwest.  

❇️🦅❇️

 BEAT THE 👹’s On Band Day!  9-6-21
6:30 pm, Apogee Stadium. Be there, Dano! Aloha!

Edited August 16, 2021 by PlummMeanGreen

[rws69]

14 hours ago, GreenN'walinsVet said:

If im the BIG 12 teams im doing a full court press on Arkansas, Missouri, Nebraska, and Colorado to all flip over and join the BIG 12.  They all would come in at the top and be in better competitive situations then what they are in now.

This makes no $en$e.

 

[ColoradoEagle]

Not even wearing my homer cap, North Texas brings more to the table than SMU. And before people start hacking out their replies, we're not even close to contention for moving to that conference.

There's just no reason that any conference will be chomping at the bit to add a school whose football games regularly see 10-12k actual attendance unless they're playing a B12 or local school. Anyone who was actually in school around the time of the death penalty is in their mid-50s now. Those there during their heyday? In their 60s.

Some people just love making a big deal out of that school when in reality, they're no different from Rice.

[MrAlien]

whats going to be left of the former Big12 is not a power conference, and I dont see them adding the right schools to become one. 

[untjim1995]

More and more, it appears that the remaining 8 schools are in deep $hit. If I had to guess, in order of attractiveness to a power conference, your see this:

KU--AAU member with powerful basketball brand and a good TV market to deliver, but horrific football

WVU--good football and basketball brand, would blend in well in the ACC with Pitt and the Virginia schools, but terrible academics and no TV market whatsoever.

ISU--AAU member, turned into a solid football program, has been great in the past in hoops, no TV market at all, and sit in a state with a B1G team already

OSU/Texas Tech--these two are twins at this point, selling their exposure to Texas and Oklahoma, but terrible academic rankings, even though both have had big athletic success over the years in sports that matter.

KSU--see above, but without the market, and again, poor academic rankings

TCU--small private school in DFW, so will try to see on being able to deliver this market, solid reputation in football, but just nothing to really make a power conference grab them, IMO. 

Baylor--yes, they have had great success in the revenue sports over the last decade, and has great academic ranking. BUt theres just too much baggage here

[Mean Green 93-98]

At this point, I don't see any way the BXII lures away any teams present in another P5 conference.

The teams with a decent possibility of joining another P5 conference: KU, WVU

For those teams unable to find a spot in another P5 conference, their best bet for now is unquestionably to hunker down in the BXII, and possibly add some teams as long as they don't dilute the conference.  Decent possibilities: Houston, Boise State, BYU, Memphis, Cincinnati, Central Florida

[greenminer]

3 hours ago, Wag Tag said:

The have nots are eventually going to have to fill their stadiums to make money. You do that with regional competition. ( UNT playing SMU example)  SWC needs to come back.

I wish it were as simple as playing within your region.

People have teams they love to hate on.  Sometimes it's regional.  Sometimes it's another team for a chance at a championship.  People love winning championships, and sometimes that means they will only show up for the contender on the other side of the map.

Regional teams aren't THE solution.  They are a possible solution.

[El Paso Eagle]

Here is what I am worried we are heading to
P4 - SEC-BG10-ACC-PAC12 (If they do not break away)

NEXT 3 - BIG12 - AAC- MWC

FINAL 3 - CUSA-SBC-MAC

[Mean Green 93-98]

22 minutes ago, El Paso Eagle said:

Here is what I am worried we are heading to
P4 - SEC-BG10-ACC-PAC12 (If they do not break away)

NEXT 3 - BIG12 - AAC- MWC

FINAL 3 - CUSA-SBC-MAC

For now, there is still a substantial gap between the B12 and AAC/MWC.  At least in terms of fan support and what they can demand in TV revenues.

[El Paso Eagle]

12 minutes ago, Mean Green 93-98 said:

For now, there is still a substantial gap between the B12 and AAC/MWC.  At least in terms of fan support and what they can demand in TV revenues.

But once OU and Texas are out of the mix the gap closes.  Here is some info I found.

 

Bottom line is viewership is not that different

[Mean Green 93-98]

8 minutes ago, El Paso Eagle said:

But once OU and Texas are out of the mix the gap closes.  Here is some info I found.

 

Bottom line is viewership is not that different

Interesting, thanks for posting.  A little surprising, and if I had the time, I would want to examine that a little more closely.

That said, B12 fan support still blows away fan support from any G5 conferences.  Houston attendance is typically in the lower 20k's, while a typical Saturday in Ames, Iowa will draw around 60k.

[El Paso Eagle]

33 minutes ago, Mean Green 93-98 said:

Interesting, thanks for posting.  A little surprising, and if I had the time, I would want to examine that a little more closely.

That said, B12 fan support still blows away fan support from any G5 conferences.  Houston attendance is typically in the lower 20k's, while a typical Saturday in Ames, Iowa will draw around 60k.

No doubt. Outside KU Football the other programs have fairly good FB programs. Found this in an SI article - 

 

Texas annually puts nearly 100,000 fans in the seats for home football games, a top 10 program in terms of attendance. Oklahoma is mid-80,000s, a top 15 attendance program. After that, no Big 12 school has averaged 60,000 fans per home game from 2017-19. Iowa State, West Virginia, Texas Tech and Oklahoma State all have been in the mid-to-high 50,000s; Kansas State, Baylor and TCU are the next tier; and Kansas is its own mud flat of apathy.

[wardly]

7 hours ago, MrAlien said:

whats going to be left of the former Big12 is not a power conference, and I dont see them adding the right schools to become one. 

There are no right schools to add that would maintain their status quo with the loss of Texas and Oklahoma let alone keep the Big 12 as a real P5 conference. Without these two heavyweights as anchors they drop below the P4 conferences but stay ahead of the AAC.  

---

[DeepGreen]

I dunno guys.  If the leaders of UNT, that is the President of UNT and our Athletic Director, do not make a presentation to the Big 12 and request entry to the Big 12 Conference, I would consider that a dereliction of duty. I would be disappointed in our inaction on such an important issue. More than that, I would be pissed off.

[greenminer]

21 minutes ago, DeepGreen said:

I dunno guys.  If the leaders of UNT, that is the President of UNT and our Athletic Director, do not make a presentation to the Big 12 and request entry to the Big 12 Conference, I would consider that a dereliction of duty. I would be disappointed in our inaction on such an important issue. More than that, I would be pissed off.

if they aren't presenting any kind of request for entry, then perhaps they know something we don't.

Just a thought.