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7 minutes ago, TheColonyEagle said:

And the coach and his agent used those expectations for more money....then he didn't hold up his end of the bargain.

Probably.   But that doesn't mean fire the guy.   
However, it certainly should mean no additional raise/extension this year, since he earned the first two by over-achieving, then just plummeted this year.
You gotta think Littrell will understand.
I can accept a "down year" here and there.  It happens to everyone.   There needs to be an expectation that the "down year" still must include going at least 6-6 with a bowl game though.
North Texas needs to be through with the 5-wins-or-less years.  There is too much upward trending  (Namely, the HC's salary) for those to be acceptable anymore.

Crater against WINLESS Rice, and/or "rebuilding" UAB to finish at 5 wins (or 4!), and I'll have serious concerns about Littrell's future here.  That would put us at full-circle with his first year here and that is not acceptable.
Win both, and this year sucks really bad, but will be a blip and we can move on.

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15 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Probably.   But that doesn't mean fire the guy.   
However, it certainly should mean no additional raise/extension this year, since he earned the first two by over-achieving, then just plummeted this year.
You gotta think Littrell will understand.
I can accept a "down year" here and there.  It happens to everyone.   There needs to be an expectation that the "down year" still must include going at least 6-6 with a bowl game though.
North Texas needs to be through with the 5-wins-or-less years.  There is too much upward trending  (Namely, the HC's salary) for those to be acceptable anymore.

Crater against WINLESS Rice, and/or "rebuilding" UAB to finish at 5 wins (or 4!), and I'll have serious concerns about Littrell's future here.  That would put us at full-circle with his first year here and that is not acceptable.
Win both, and this year sucks really bad, but will be a blip and we can move on.

I'm not calling for him to get fired.....yet

But his window is closing. He got the big fat deal. So now he needs to give a return on it.

He should be able to win this conference....if that's not the expectation then why did they pay him all that money.

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Just now, TheColonyEagle said:

I'm not calling for him to get fired.....yet

But his window is closing. He got the big fat deal. So now he needs to give a return on it.

He should be able to win this conference....if that's not the expectation then why did they pay him all that money.


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OK...here comes a bye week rant on why I have completely changed my view of Seth Littrell.

It has everything to do with how I view my "relationship" with UNT Athletics. My "relationship" has always been an emotional one....similar to most alumni. I'm a UNT Homer....I'll admit it. I'll defend everything UNT to the death. Administrators, Coaches, especially Players. I defended Simon, Dickey, Dodge, McCarney....I even defended RV for a while until I just couldn't take it anymore. 

And I was all in on Littrell and viewed him with patience for this rebuild....right up until he and his agent dangled KState (which I still say wasn't real) and basically forced his way into becoming the highest paid coach in the conference....heavily based on media hype including that damn punt return. (Make no mistake....Littrell got as much leverage out of that play as UNT did)

In essence, what Littrell said was "I'll stay here and keep building....as long as you pay me more money." I'm not saying it's wrong to do that. I'm not saying it’s wrong to "play the game," and I'm not saying it's wrong to use leverage....

However, from that point.....my view on Littrell was no longer through an emotional lens but now a transactional one.

It's all transactional now.

Tougher schedule? Nope....earn your money. Injuries? Nope....earn your money. Tough rebuild? Nope....earn your money. Historical challenges? Nope.........Just Win.

My view on Littrell is now solely based on the pay day HE wanted and got. When he says something that may be emotional, ("This is home, my family loves it here, this place is unbelievable") I now make sure to add the transactional part behind it, the condition: "as long as they pay me more money." So I don't care about the rest of it. Earn your money. I don't care that Littrell says "this is home" because what I hear is "this is home....as long as you pay me more money." So here's the other side to that. Since it's all transactional at this point....I will donate to the program....as long as you win. I will renew my season tickets....as long as you win. I will come to the games.....as long as you win. That transaction goes both ways. The AD expects my unconditional support yet the head coach's own view of UNT is based solely on conditions....it doesn't go both ways. My support for the football program will be conditional. You win, I support. That's the deal.

So, if you don't win....I don't want you here. All transactions. You better out recruit the other coaches in the conference.........or you can leave. Get us a championship........or you can leave.                   

All transactions.

I know...."hey any coach is going to entertain bigger jobs" I get it. I'm not naive. I know coaches aren't doing this for free. But you better believe there are expectations that come with that. And his 4th year has been a monumental failure. He is the highest paid coach in the conference and ANYTHING short of winning it is a failure and especially getting buried like he has this season. And he hasn't won anything of substance yet. EVER. But he wanted to be paid like he had. When he forced our hand, his benefit of the doubt was gone...no excuses. "What did you expect? For him to not ask for more money?" Of course not. But he did and he got it. Now....if he doesn't win a championship in the next.....2 years? He should be fired. Period. That will be 6 years and he hasn't won the worst conference in FBS. Think about that. And I didn't set that expectation, Littrell did. So Win or Leave. That's the deal. And this may piss some people off because I know he's untouchable...but Wren Baker's expectation better be the same because if it's not....then he's going to need to answer for why he gave Littrell the money he did yet didn't expect championships in return. I don't care that they're young up and comers and buddies.....deliver for your fan base the way you expect your fan base to deliver for you in support and attendance. That delivery is wins. All the shiny new stuff is hollow if it doesn't produce wins. Without wins there's no substance to any of it. And if Littrell can't take advantage of it...get someone in here that will.

We showed....now you show. 

I don't know if we fully appreciate what an unbelievable disaster this season has been and I don't see it getting any better anytime soon. He better figure it out in the off season because I believe his checks are still going to come to him....If he figures it out....and he wins the conference next year for the first time (in his 5th year).....I'll renew in 2021. If you have a problem with that mindset....then you must really have a problem with Littrell because he did the same thing to your alma mater. He doesn't give two shits about UNT.....he has conditions for being here....lots of money. And now so do I. The condition is, show me wins and then I'll support. Not the other way around. I'm Wren Baker and Seth Littrell's customer...they are not mine. The burden is on them....not me.

It's all Transactions from now on

Littrell: "I love this place as long as they pay me lots of money"

Me: "I support Littrell as long as he wins championships"

Pretty simple in my eyes.

 

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3 minutes ago, TheColonyEagle said:

OK...here comes a bye week rant on why I have completely changed my view of Seth Littrell.

It has everything to do with how I view my "relationship" with UNT Athletics. My "relationship" has always been an emotional one....similar to most alumni. I'm a UNT Homer....I'll admit it. I'll defend everything UNT to the death. Administrators, Coaches, especially Players. I defended Simon, Dickey, Dodge, McCarney....I even defended RV for a while until I just couldn't take it anymore. 

And I was all in on Littrell and viewed him with patience for this rebuild....right up until he and his agent dangled KState (which I still say wasn't real) and basically forced his way into becoming the highest paid coach in the conference....heavily based on media hype including that damn punt return. (Make no mistake....Littrell got as much leverage out of that play as UNT did)

In essence, what Littrell said was "I'll stay here and keep building....as long as you pay me more money." I'm not saying it's wrong to do that. I'm not saying it’s wrong to "play the game," and I'm not saying it's wrong to use leverage....

However, from that point.....my view on Littrell was no longer through an emotional lens but now a transactional one.

It's all transactional now.

Tougher schedule? Nope....earn your money. Injuries? Nope....earn your money. Tough rebuild? Nope....earn your money. Historical challenges? Nope.........Just Win.

My view on Littrell is now solely based on the pay day HE wanted and got. When he says something that may be emotional, ("This is home, my family loves it here, this place is unbelievable") I now make sure to add the transactional part behind it, the condition: "as long as they pay me more money." So I don't care about the rest of it. Earn your money. I don't care that Littrell says "this is home" because what I hear is "this is home....as long as you pay me more money." So here's the other side to that. Since it's all transactional at this point....I will donate to the program....as long as you win. I will renew my season tickets....as long as you win. I will come to the games.....as long as you win. That transaction goes both ways. The AD expects my unconditional support yet the head coach's own view of UNT is based solely on conditions....it doesn't go both ways. My support for the football program will be conditional. You win, I support. That's the deal.

So, if you don't win....I don't want you here. All transactions. You better out recruit the other coaches in the conference.........or you can leave. Get us a championship........or you can leave.                   

All transactions.

I know...."hey any coach is going to entertain bigger jobs" I get it. I'm not naive. I know coaches aren't doing this for free. But you better believe there are expectations that come with that. And his 4th year has been a monumental failure. He is the highest paid coach in the conference and ANYTHING short of winning it is a failure and especially getting buried like he has this season. And he hasn't won anything of substance yet. EVER. But he wanted to be paid like he had. When he forced our hand, his benefit of the doubt was gone...no excuses. "What did you expect? For him to not ask for more money?" Of course not. But he did and he got it. Now....if he doesn't win a championship in the next.....2 years? He should be fired. Period. That will be 6 years and he hasn't won the worst conference in FBS. Think about that. And I didn't set that expectation, Littrell did. So Win or Leave. That's the deal. And this may piss some people off because I know he's untouchable...but Wren Baker's expectation better be the same because if it's not....then he's going to need to answer for why he gave Littrell the money he did yet didn't expect championships in return. I don't care that they're young up and comers and buddies.....deliver for your fan base the way you expect your fan base to deliver for you in support and attendance. That delivery is wins. All the shiny new stuff is hollow if it doesn't produce wins. Without wins there's no substance to any of it. And if Littrell can't take advantage of it...get someone in here that will.

We showed....now you show. 

I don't know if we fully appreciate what an unbelievable disaster this season has been and I don't see it getting any better anytime soon. He better figure it out in the off season because I believe his checks are still going to come to him....If he figures it out....and he wins the conference next year for the first time (in his 5th year).....I'll renew in 2021. If you have a problem with that mindset....then you must really have a problem with Littrell because he did the same thing to your alma mater. He doesn't give two shits about UNT.....he has conditions for being here....lots of money. And now so do I. The condition is, show me wins and then I'll support. Not the other way around. I'm Wren Baker and Seth Littrell's customer...they are not mine. The burden is on them....not me.

It's all Transactions from now on

Littrell: "I love this place as long as they pay me lots of money"

Me: "I support Littrell as long as he wins championships"

Pretty simple in my eyes.

 

I would agree with this, if Seth Littrell were out there playing the game 1V1 against other coaches...   

Instead, we have fellow Alumni out there donning our colors and playing for us.   Those guys deserve our support.  The money stuff paid to coaches will work itself out...   Recall, those boosters are just as big of fans as we are!

And, my MGSF dollars don't just go to football players.   From swimming to soccer, all of the athletes deserve our support as well.

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Just now, MeanGreenTexan said:

I would agree with this, if Seth Littrell were out there playing the game 1V1 against other coaches...   

Instead, we have fellow Alumni out there donning our colors and playing for us.   Those guys deserve our support.  The money stuff paid to coaches will work itself out...   Recall, those boosters are just as big of fans as we are!

And, my MGSF dollars don't just go to football players.   From swimming to soccer, all of the athletes deserve our support as well.

I guess Littrell took the additional money he got in his new deal and gave it all back to the Scholarship fund then...

Those are highly paid employees in that department and they're not going to use the "if you love your university and the student athletes you'll donate" all the while giving big raises to themselves....

The burden is on them....not me. It's why they make so much money. They control how much they get in donations....not me.

Transactions. Not emotions. That precedent has been set.

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34 minutes ago, TheColonyEagle said:

OK...here comes a bye week rant on why I have completely changed my view of Seth Littrell.

It has everything to do with how I view my "relationship" with UNT Athletics. My "relationship" has always been an emotional one....similar to most alumni. I'm a UNT Homer....I'll admit it. I'll defend everything UNT to the death. Administrators, Coaches, especially Players. I defended Simon, Dickey, Dodge, McCarney....I even defended RV for a while until I just couldn't take it anymore. 

And I was all in on Littrell and viewed him with patience for this rebuild....right up until he and his agent dangled KState (which I still say wasn't real) and basically forced his way into becoming the highest paid coach in the conference....heavily based on media hype including that damn punt return. (Make no mistake....Littrell got as much leverage out of that play as UNT did)

In essence, what Littrell said was "I'll stay here and keep building....as long as you pay me more money." I'm not saying it's wrong to do that. I'm not saying it’s wrong to "play the game," and I'm not saying it's wrong to use leverage....

However, from that point.....my view on Littrell was no longer through an emotional lens but now a transactional one.

It's all transactional now.

Tougher schedule? Nope....earn your money. Injuries? Nope....earn your money. Tough rebuild? Nope....earn your money. Historical challenges? Nope.........Just Win.

My view on Littrell is now solely based on the pay day HE wanted and got. When he says something that may be emotional, ("This is home, my family loves it here, this place is unbelievable") I now make sure to add the transactional part behind it, the condition: "as long as they pay me more money." So I don't care about the rest of it. Earn your money. I don't care that Littrell says "this is home" because what I hear is "this is home....as long as you pay me more money." So here's the other side to that. Since it's all transactional at this point....I will donate to the program....as long as you win. I will renew my season tickets....as long as you win. I will come to the games.....as long as you win. That transaction goes both ways. The AD expects my unconditional support yet the head coach's own view of UNT is based solely on conditions....it doesn't go both ways. My support for the football program will be conditional. You win, I support. That's the deal.

So, if you don't win....I don't want you here. All transactions. You better out recruit the other coaches in the conference.........or you can leave. Get us a championship........or you can leave.                   

All transactions.

I know...."hey any coach is going to entertain bigger jobs" I get it. I'm not naive. I know coaches aren't doing this for free. But you better believe there are expectations that come with that. And his 4th year has been a monumental failure. He is the highest paid coach in the conference and ANYTHING short of winning it is a failure and especially getting buried like he has this season. And he hasn't won anything of substance yet. EVER. But he wanted to be paid like he had. When he forced our hand, his benefit of the doubt was gone...no excuses. "What did you expect? For him to not ask for more money?" Of course not. But he did and he got it. Now....if he doesn't win a championship in the next.....2 years? He should be fired. Period. That will be 6 years and he hasn't won the worst conference in FBS. Think about that. And I didn't set that expectation, Littrell did. So Win or Leave. That's the deal. And this may piss some people off because I know he's untouchable...but Wren Baker's expectation better be the same because if it's not....then he's going to need to answer for why he gave Littrell the money he did yet didn't expect championships in return. I don't care that they're young up and comers and buddies.....deliver for your fan base the way you expect your fan base to deliver for you in support and attendance. That delivery is wins. All the shiny new stuff is hollow if it doesn't produce wins. Without wins there's no substance to any of it. And if Littrell can't take advantage of it...get someone in here that will.

We showed....now you show. 

I don't know if we fully appreciate what an unbelievable disaster this season has been and I don't see it getting any better anytime soon. He better figure it out in the off season because I believe his checks are still going to come to him....If he figures it out....and he wins the conference next year for the first time (in his 5th year).....I'll renew in 2021. If you have a problem with that mindset....then you must really have a problem with Littrell because he did the same thing to your alma mater. He doesn't give two shits about UNT.....he has conditions for being here....lots of money. And now so do I. The condition is, show me wins and then I'll support. Not the other way around. I'm Wren Baker and Seth Littrell's customer...they are not mine. The burden is on them....not me.

It's all Transactions from now on

Littrell: "I love this place as long as they pay me lots of money"

Me: "I support Littrell as long as he wins championships"

Pretty simple in my eyes.

 

tenor.gif?itemid=10380822

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Your relationship to the players should be emotional.  They chose to come here, usually over competing offers, and are students and alumni just like you and I are.

You never should have had an emotional connection to the coaches.  They are contract employees.  They will do what is best for them.  They aren't a beloved tenured chemistry professor, or even a academic counselor who has been here for 20+ years.  They really have no skin in NT's game long term. 

Getting attached to a football coach is like getting attached to whoever came in and did drywall on the IPF. 

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2 minutes ago, Cerebus said:

Your relationship to the players should be emotional.  They chose to come here, usually over competing offers, and are students and alumni just like you and I are.

You never should have had an emotional connection to the coaches.  They are contract employees.  They will do what is best for them.  They aren't a beloved tenured chemistry professor, or even a academic counselor who has been here for 20+ years.  They really have no skin in NT's game long term. 

Getting attached to a football coach is like getting attached to whoever came in and did drywall on the IPF. 

Good point....and in that case, if a decision maker is giving the drywall contractor more money....that dry wall contractor better be great or he needs to be fired.

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8 minutes ago, Cerebus said:

Your relationship to the players should be emotional.  They chose to come here, usually over competing offers, and are students and alumni just like you and I are.

You never should have had an emotional connection to the coaches.  They are contract employees.  They will do what is best for them.  They aren't a beloved tenured chemistry professor, or even a academic counselor who has been here for 20+ years.  They really have no skin in NT's game long term. 

Getting attached to a football coach is like getting attached to whoever came in and did drywall on the IPF. 

Hey like I said....I'm not naive....I get it. These coaches get big bucks. It's a business. But the athletic department DOES lean on the emotional side of its alumni and fans. Of course we're emotional....we're fans. We get to see Littrell up on the screen at Apogee look lovingly into the camera and say "home." The athletic department needs people to have an emotional attachment to its coaches or it wouldn't market them that way.

I wasn't making the argument that you should have an emotional attachment to coaches. But it's natural to have one....because they do represent your university. Littrell is all hype to this point...basically he's a fake. And if you or I or anyone is going to look at any coach at UNT with an emotionless view then do it. I certainly do.

The bottom line is Littrell needs to win the conference in the next 2 years or he needs to be gone. Fire the "contract employee" and get another one.

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This was after the USM game last year...What he was saying was in year 3....rain shouldn't have kept fans away because Seth Littrell deserved better. (leaving the players out of this...they always deserve better but they didn't demand more guaranteed money nor do they get to ride on the jet with him.)

We're wrapping up year 4 headed to year 5 with loads of questions. I hope he's asking our contract employee when he's going to start doing HIS part if the expectation of the fans is to do theirs....

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First of all, we need to hope, pray, chant or whatever for Seth Littrell to turn this thing around for himself, for those who hired him & for We the Fans.  If that happens then we’ll know having the best venues in CUSA (& many other G5 schools in other conferences) has paid off.  Never met SL but I’m pulling for him to grow with his job & make it happen for all concerned.

Second of all, ‚ÄúDo you believe in the Mean Green‚ÄĚ was a phrase ¬†(as most know) coined by George Dunham during the McNeese St. rain game with a tad over 20,000 Mean Green fans at Fouts Field¬†¬†& the most colorful collection of umbrellas you‚Äôd ever see. ¬†It was a MG highlight for many of us & yes, I believe.

GMG!

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Well it is all getting very old. We like to give grief to the bandwagon people who pull for a big winner whose campus they’ve never been on. But please tell me how NT football is ever going to get out of its rut, that with very limited and intermittent breaks, has been going on for decades. I have two schools to go for and the other is currently gearing up to lose to its in-state rival for the 16th year in a row. So they’re in about the same situation, but hey there’s basketball, baseball, tennis and soccer, etc. I just don’t connect with those sports the same way.  I said I’m ok with NT as long as we consistently win more than lose but I absolutely cannot stand these thunderous beatdowns over and over again, from a tiny budget place like LT. The whole university should be embarrassed and make it a priority to avoid those in the future.

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9 hours ago, Cerebus said:

Getting attached to a football coach is like getting attached to whoever came in and did drywall on the IPF. 

I like to think they’re a step up from that. Just enough that we acknowledge them as candidates in our athletics HOF. That isn’t done for the guy who finished the drywall.

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12 hours ago, greenminer said:

I like to think they’re a step up from that. Just enough that we acknowledge them as candidates in our athletics HOF. That isn’t done for the guy who finished the drywall.

Fine.  It's like getting attached to the general contractor who hires the drywall guys. 

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On 11/12/2019 at 1:23 PM, TheColonyEagle said:

OK...here comes a bye week rant on why I have completely changed my view of Seth Littrell.

It has everything to do with how I view my "relationship" with UNT Athletics. My "relationship" has always been an emotional one....similar to most alumni. I'm a UNT Homer....I'll admit it. I'll defend everything UNT to the death. Administrators, Coaches, especially Players. I defended Simon, Dickey, Dodge, McCarney....I even defended RV for a while until I just couldn't take it anymore. 

And I was all in on Littrell and viewed him with patience for this rebuild....right up until he and his agent dangled KState (which I still say wasn't real) and basically forced his way into becoming the highest paid coach in the conference....heavily based on media hype including that damn punt return. (Make no mistake....Littrell got as much leverage out of that play as UNT did)

In essence, what Littrell said was "I'll stay here and keep building....as long as you pay me more money." I'm not saying it's wrong to do that. I'm not saying it’s wrong to "play the game," and I'm not saying it's wrong to use leverage....

However, from that point.....my view on Littrell was no longer through an emotional lens but now a transactional one.

It's all transactional now.

Tougher schedule? Nope....earn your money. Injuries? Nope....earn your money. Tough rebuild? Nope....earn your money. Historical challenges? Nope.........Just Win.

My view on Littrell is now solely based on the pay day HE wanted and got. When he says something that may be emotional, ("This is home, my family loves it here, this place is unbelievable") I now make sure to add the transactional part behind it, the condition: "as long as they pay me more money." So I don't care about the rest of it. Earn your money. I don't care that Littrell says "this is home" because what I hear is "this is home....as long as you pay me more money." So here's the other side to that. Since it's all transactional at this point....I will donate to the program....as long as you win. I will renew my season tickets....as long as you win. I will come to the games.....as long as you win. That transaction goes both ways. The AD expects my unconditional support yet the head coach's own view of UNT is based solely on conditions....it doesn't go both ways. My support for the football program will be conditional. You win, I support. That's the deal.

So, if you don't win....I don't want you here. All transactions. You better out recruit the other coaches in the conference.........or you can leave. Get us a championship........or you can leave.                   

All transactions.

I know...."hey any coach is going to entertain bigger jobs" I get it. I'm not naive. I know coaches aren't doing this for free. But you better believe there are expectations that come with that. And his 4th year has been a monumental failure. He is the highest paid coach in the conference and ANYTHING short of winning it is a failure and especially getting buried like he has this season. And he hasn't won anything of substance yet. EVER. But he wanted to be paid like he had. When he forced our hand, his benefit of the doubt was gone...no excuses. "What did you expect? For him to not ask for more money?" Of course not. But he did and he got it. Now....if he doesn't win a championship in the next.....2 years? He should be fired. Period. That will be 6 years and he hasn't won the worst conference in FBS. Think about that. And I didn't set that expectation, Littrell did. So Win or Leave. That's the deal. And this may piss some people off because I know he's untouchable...but Wren Baker's expectation better be the same because if it's not....then he's going to need to answer for why he gave Littrell the money he did yet didn't expect championships in return. I don't care that they're young up and comers and buddies.....deliver for your fan base the way you expect your fan base to deliver for you in support and attendance. That delivery is wins. All the shiny new stuff is hollow if it doesn't produce wins. Without wins there's no substance to any of it. And if Littrell can't take advantage of it...get someone in here that will.

We showed....now you show. 

I don't know if we fully appreciate what an unbelievable disaster this season has been and I don't see it getting any better anytime soon. He better figure it out in the off season because I believe his checks are still going to come to him....If he figures it out....and he wins the conference next year for the first time (in his 5th year).....I'll renew in 2021. If you have a problem with that mindset....then you must really have a problem with Littrell because he did the same thing to your alma mater. He doesn't give two shits about UNT.....he has conditions for being here....lots of money. And now so do I. The condition is, show me wins and then I'll support. Not the other way around. I'm Wren Baker and Seth Littrell's customer...they are not mine. The burden is on them....not me.

It's all Transactions from now on

Littrell: "I love this place as long as they pay me lots of money"

Me: "I support Littrell as long as he wins championships"

Pretty simple in my eyes.

 

I'm right there with you. I didn't go to the UTEP game. And I am trying to bring myself to going to the season finale. But, I may not. W or L the value to go isn't there because SL butchered this season with a meat cleaver. It's been an absolute colossal failure. The kind that makes me want to turn into a true casual fan. 

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You should know that like doesn't work like that.  Just getting more money doesn't make you anymore likely to win than the lowest paid coach in the league.   

I don't know why many continue to bring this up.  Littrell did absolutely the right thing for his family.  He didn't take a gun and force Baker to give him a raise.   Whether Baker made a bad decision is the question.

I really doubt Littrell had any chance at the KSU job. 

Coaches are going to do everything they can to win.  Littrell or any other head coach does not benefit from losing. 

We can all sit here like it is us paying his salary, and lament the results.  Littrell is not going anywhere, but the seat will be hot next year.

 

 

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I still support SL because I think he is a fierce competitor that is willing to change until he finds the success he is looking for.  He will learn from this season and build on it.    On top of that things feel less bleak to me because we have been unlocking the mysterious recruiting box.  I have never seen us recruit well, outside of a couple good Darrell Dickey classes, until recently.   

 

Now to say something deeply unpopular.   Mason Fine is not a big game player.  He has racked up amazing stats against lower and equal teams. When it comes to winning the big game not only does the team lay an egg but Mason generally looks pedestrian at best.  I think he is a good player and even better human being but I think he shares some blame in the teams big game woes.  

Edited by HoustonEagle
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23 minutes ago, HoustonEagle said:

I still support SL because I think he is a fierce competitor that is willing to change untilNow to say something deeply unpopular.   Mason Fine is not a big game player.  He has racked up amazing stats against lower and equal teams. When it comes to winning the big game not only does the team lay an egg but Mason generally looks pedestrian at best.  I think he is a good player and even better human being but I think he shares some blame in the teams big game woes.  

I agree with your SL assessment because of the constant losing culture he inherited & because his predecessor set us back with Texas HS coaches which hurt SL’s early recruiting classes.

I respectfully disagree with your thoughts on Mason Fine.  I’m trying to count how many All CUSA linemen Fine had blocking for him & the offense the last 4 years?

Fine‚Äôs ¬†performance before a (then ranked) PAC 12 team out in Berkeley this Fall ¬†before a team some national sports scribes said had one of the 3 best secondaries among all P5 schools means¬†something. ¬†¬†It¬†proved to me under the right circumstances (with at least a couple of All CUSA linemen in front of our QB)¬†our W/L ¬†results would be even¬†better, but now our ‚ÄúD‚ÄĚ problem is another entire thread.¬†

GMG!

 

Edited by PlummMeanGreen
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