Transfers, transfers, transfers

[ChiefTenBeers2015]

How much success does the Mean Green need to have in order to get student athletes interested in transferring to the program?  What booster support is needed?  Watching SMUt at HU and the announcers are talking about all the transfers on both teams.  Does it take a bowl game win or another conference championship?  UNT is ranked 12th in FBS in conference championships with I think 22 or 25...whatever it is the Mean Green needs to find a way to get more three star (or dare I say four star?) recruits interested in moving on, come to Denton... 

  Sonny Dykes comes from an innovative coaching tree, looks like he’s innovating again in the sport.  Mean Green need to look at what’s going on in FBS and see if they can’t also capitalize.  

GMG

[Harry]

13 hours ago, ChiefTenBeers2015 said:

How much success does the Mean Green need to have in order to get student athletes interested in transferring to the program?  What booster support is needed?  Watching SMUt at HU and the announcers are talking about all the transfers on both teams.  Does it take a bowl game win or another conference championship?  UNT is ranked 12th in FBS in conference championships with I think 22 or 25...whatever it is the Mean Green needs to find a way to get more three star (or dare I say four star?) recruits interested in moving on, come to Denton... 

  Sonny Dykes comes from an innovative coaching tree, looks like he’s innovating again in the sport.  Mean Green need to look at what’s going on in FBS and see if they can’t also capitalize.  

GMG

It looks to me like it is the question of G5 Program recruiting philosophy.   Do you recruit to "Culture" or do you recruit best talent available to win.  SMU has gone out and gotten great talent and focused their attention on the model of getting great athletes from the DFW area and Texas who went to P5 programs to transfer in.  North Texas has focused on getting great high school players who best fit the culture that has been developed by Coach Littrell. Sonny scoured the transfer market for the best talent he could put on the field right away.  Holgerson has adopted the same philospohy at Houston.  I have not studied Boise, UCF and other elite G5's but I sense that the transfer / juco player fits into their recruiting philospohy as well.

In a perfect world, you would do all of your recruiting out of local and state high schools but this SMU season has clearly illustrated that formula may work well for the G5 schools.  Here's the issue for SMU is what happens after Buchele graduates?  Does he make the transfer methodology work so well?  It's too early to say but I think we would all agree he is a helluva player.

I think we need to study what is going on at places like La. Tech who have less resources yet consistently put together good talent and winning teams at the C-USA level.

We need to make data driven decisions in recruiting and I think culture can be a difficult measurement to gauge.

[MrStrange18]

I am sure we are not the only ones who are thinking about this... I hope the coaches are trying to do the same things other G5 Texas teams are doing to be competitive to get the best players we can.. via HS or the Transfer Portal. 

The tough thing about the Transfer Portal to me... is it feels more like a "rent a player" system.  You have them for 1 year and they are gone... It will be interesting to see what SMU looks like next year.  Will they be able to get more transfers or not?  Maybe this will be their new norm? We will have to wait and see...

I would, personally, like  a mix of both... that way we dont have all of our eggs in one basket or the other. However... that doesnt seem to be working out best for us at the moment lol

GMG

[golfingomez]

I think people might be highly overrating the transfer route. Yes, SMU is having success with it, but it's definitely a jump-start method and something where a lot of things have to go right in order for it to work.

I doubt Sonny is going to do this again, as it is a one time talent infusion. It's also something that could go terribly wrong without the right leadership/team buy in.

[keith]

1 hour ago, Harry said:

<snip>

In a perfect world, you would do all of your recruiting out of local and state high schools but this SMU season has clearly illustrated that formula may work well for the G5 schools.  Here's the issue for SMU is what happens after Buchele graduates?  Does he make the transfer methodology work so well?  It's too early to say but I think we would all agree he is a helluva player.

<snip>

The Buchele situation confuses me.  He's listed as a Junior, so he'll play next year as well, right?  When he transferred he was listed as immediately available.  Did he already graduate from Texas?  Since he was immediately available I assume that means he was a graduate transfer, but with two years of eligibility left.  Normally we think of graduate transfers as one and done, but not in this case?  Worked out well for SMU, that's for sure.

[SilverEagle]

The other factor to look at for SMU is how lucky have they been re: injuries this year?  Have they played relatively injury free this year?

[BillySee58]

1 hour ago, golfingomez said:

I think people might be highly overrating the transfer route. Yes, SMU is having success with it, but it's definitely a jump-start method and something where a lot of things have to go right in order for it to work.

I doubt Sonny is going to do this again, as it is a one time talent infusion. It's also something that could go terribly wrong without the right leadership/team buy in.

3 of SMU’s starters were added from other D1 schools this past offseason. 15 of their 22 starters signed with SMU out of high school or JUCO. 

Their lineup isn’t nearly as D1-transfer heavy as people are making it out to be. Heck, we added 2 starters via D1 transfer (Plantin and Harvey) this offseason, meaning we added just one less D1 transfer starter this offseason than SMU did.

[agw0038]

I agree. The biggest difference for SMU this year has been quarterback play. Yes, the Norte Dame kid definitley helps at receiver but is this not essentially still the same team we were beating 31-0 last year? 

Also, their schedule has been weak. This is the way I see it, They defended their home turf against us. They've beat all the teams their suppose to beat and then they got lucky at the end of the game against Tulsa and Houston. 

I try not to hate too much because they are having a good season. (The Triple D jerseys are clean)

Also, on a side note:

There is most def a media bias for SMU...

Its interesting that they seem to be struggling to gain the support of the metroplex where as the media seems to be "all in".

I feel like it was the exact opposite for us last year.

#GMG

[PlummMeanGreen]

47 minutes ago, BillySee58 said:

3 of SMU’s starters were added from other D1 schools this past offseason. 15 of their 22 starters signed with SMU out of high school or JUCO. 

So 7 of their portal transfers were enough to get them to #16?

Seems of late if we had 7 transfers half of em’ would not report to Fall 2-A-Days. Maybe our luck will change with that.

SMU may be the Dallas media’s darlings but they’ll still have to give 15,000 free tickets away for a #16 ranked team to fill their stadium.  

😳 Did I hear the ESPN broadcast guy say they actually had 30+ transfers this last year?

GMG!

Edited October 25, 2019 by PlummMeanGreen

[BillySee58]

14 minutes ago, PlummMeanGreen said:

So 7 of their portal transfers were enough to get them to #16?

Seems of late if we had 7 transfers half of em’ would not report to Fall 2-A-Days. Maybe our luck will change with that.

SMU may be the Dallas media’s darlings but they’ll still have to give 15,000 free tickets away for a #16 ranked team to fill their stadium.  

😳 Did I hear the ESPN broadcast guy say they actually had 30+ transfers this last year?

GMG!

This conversation is going on in another thread as well. We’re not sure where the 31 transfers in one year stat comes from since 247 shows 16 D1 transfers.

And yeah, they have done it with a lot more homegrown developed players than people on here are giving them credit for. But the transfers are very key to their operation, including the most important position (QB with Buechele) and an NFL prospect receiver in Roberson who transferred from WVU.

[untbowler]

28 minutes ago, agw0038 said:

I agree. The biggest difference for SMU this year has been quarterback play. Yes, the Norte Dame kid definitley helps at receiver but is this not essentially still the same team we were beating 31-0 last year? 

Also, their schedule has been weak. This is the way I see it, They defended their home turf against us. They've beat all the teams their suppose to beat and then they got lucky at the end of the game against Tulsa and Houston. 

I try not to hate too much because they are having a good season. (The Triple D jerseys are clean)

Also, on a side note:

There is most def a media bias for SMU...

Its interesting that they seem to be struggling to gain the support of the metroplex where as the media seems to be "all in".

I feel like it was the exact opposite for us last year.

#GMG

so they beat a good UH team on short rest, good for them, they know how to win the tight games, every ranked tea has the tight games they win during a season. 

[greenminer]

1 hour ago, BillySee58 said:

This conversation is going on in another thread as well. We’re not sure where the 31 transfers in one year stat comes from since 247 shows 16 D1 transfers.

Quote

Maybe no school in the nation has better taken advantage of transfers than SMU. A school spokesman said the football roster numbers 35 transfers, though not all are currently eligible. They didn't all come through the portal, either. Eleven are grad transfers, giving SMU 21 football players with degrees. The astounding figure leads the nation, according to the National Football Foundation.

https://www.dallasnews.com/sports/smu-mustangs/2019/09/27/players-have-more-power-than-ever-in-college-football-s-brave-new-world-and-smu-is-among-its-biggest-beneficiaries/

Edited October 25, 2019 by greenminer

[drex]

I have never trusted SMU and never will.  Good for them, they are on a roll.  However, the roll might get a bit bumpy in a year or two if they are put under the microscope by the NCAA.  NCAA loves to beat up on SMU.

[untjim1995]

2 hours ago, BillySee58 said:

3 of SMU’s starters were added from other D1 schools this past offseason. 15 of their 22 starters signed with SMU out of high school or JUCO. 

Their lineup isn’t nearly as D1-transfer heavy as people are making it out to be. Heck, we added 2 starters via D1 transfer (Plantin and Harvey) this offseason, meaning we added just one less D1 transfer starter this offseason than SMU did.

That’s what I noticed about them, too. They hit big on those 3 starters though. And Dykes is a great coach to be a QB under, since he is innovative with his schemes without getting Buechele killed. To me, watching them last night,  Buechele felt some pressure but he was able to throw downfield fairly easily against UH, meanwhile, against UH in Denton, their DLine looked like they were playing fullback every time Fine got the ball. Buechele is much bigger than Fine so he can probably handle the beating a little more than Mason, but Mason has had four years of getting manhandled and it looks as if it’s finally caught up to him. 

[BillySee58]

1 hour ago, greenminer said:

https://www.dallasnews.com/sports/smu-mustangs/2019/09/27/players-have-more-power-than-ever-in-college-football-s-brave-new-world-and-smu-is-among-its-biggest-beneficiaries/

So it sounds like those are the guys that have been added over the years who are still on their roster. Which makes a lot more sense but also doesn’t fit the narrative that these guys all showed up over night and boosted their roster to new heights over the offseason.

[GrayEagle]

5 hours ago, BillySee58 said:

3 of SMU’s starters were added from other D1 schools this past offseason. 15 of their 22 starters signed with SMU out of high school or JUCO. 

Their lineup isn’t nearly as D1-transfer heavy as people are making it out to be. Heck, we added 2 starters via D1 transfer (Plantin and Harvey) this offseason, meaning we added just one less D1 transfer starter this offseason than SMU did.

I don't know about starters but I count 23 on the roster who were not there last year.  Most of those have played this year.

Here is the list:

Abercrombie     DT             Rice

Banks                 TE             UMass

Bryant                 OL             Riverside CC

Buechele            QB             Texas

Callaway             CB             Arkansas

Choate                 DE              Utah

Fitz                        LB              Drake

Flores                   OL               Columbia

Granson               TE                Rice

Hogan                   K                 West Virginia

Holloway              LB                Kilgore

James                   TE                Alabama

Jones, Cam'ryn    DB                Nebraska

Jones, Will             DT                Baylor

McBryde                 LB                Auburn

McIntyre                 TE                Cornell

Moore                      LB               Texas A&M

Nelson                     S                  Illinois

Pugh                        DT                Tulsa

Roberts                   K                    MTSU

Sanders                   WR                Notre Dame

Stephens                 DB                 UCLA

 

[BillySee58]

Just now, GrayEagle said:

I don't know about starters but I count 23 on the roster who were not there last year.  Most of those have played this year.

Here is the list:

Abercrombie     DT             Rice

Banks                 TE             UMass

Bryant                 OL             Riverside CC

Buechele            QB             Texas

Callaway             CB             Arkansas

Choate                 DE              Utah

Fitz                        LB              Drake

Flores                   OL               Columbia

Granson               TE                Rice

Hogan                   K                 West Virginia

Holloway              LB                Kilgore

James                   TE                Alabama

Jones, Cam'ryn    DB                Nebraska

Jones, Will             DT                Baylor

McBryde                 LB                Auburn

McIntyre                 TE                Cornell

Moore                      LB               Texas A&M

Nelson                     S                  Illinois

Pugh                        DT                Tulsa

Roberts                   K                    MTSU

Sanders                   WR                Notre Dame

Stephens                 DB                 UCLA

 

Without going through each guy on your list, I know Nelson, Moore, and Sanders were all on the team last year.

[PlummMeanGreen]

10 hours ago, Harry said:

I think we need to study what is going on at places like La. Tech who have less resources yet consistently put together good talent and winning teams at the C-USA level.

Simpleton Simon here but what you do with La Tech is find out which of their assistants has beaten us regularly out of recruits & SL then poses the question:  “Hey Coach, would you like me to fly you into Alliance & then we get together for a meal in Apogee’s Hub & then.......let me give you a tour of our brand new Indoor Practice Facility.” 

Fortune 500 companies get some of their best new employees by recruiting from competitors. College Football is a business if anyone hasn’t noticed lately. 

GMG!

Edited October 26, 2019 by PlummMeanGreen

[GangGreen]

2 hours ago, PlummMeanGreen said:

Simpleton Simon here but what you do with La Tech is find out which of their assistants has beaten us regularly out of recruits & SL then poses the question:  “Hey Coach, would you like me to fly you into Alliance & then we get together for a meal in Apogee’s Hub & then.......let me give you a tour of our brand new Indoor Practice Facility.” 

Fortune 500 companies get some of their best new employees by recruiting from competitors. College Football is a business if anyone hasn’t noticed lately. 

GMG!

Why not fly them to Denton. That airport can handle a Gulfstream, no prob.

[GreenBacker]

11 hours ago, keith said:

The Buchele situation confuses me.  He's listed as a Junior, so he'll play next year as well, right?  When he transferred he was listed as immediately available.  Did he already graduate from Texas?  Since he was immediately available I assume that means he was a graduate transfer, but with two years of eligibility left.  Normally we think of graduate transfers as one and done, but not in this case?  Worked out well for SMU, that's for sure.

That is correct.  He graduated in the spring (drove up to Dallas often to watch SMU workout while still attending UT) and was immediately eligible with two years to play.  There are a few in the same boat that SMU picked up.  With kids staying on campus and taking courses in the summer, it is more and more doable to finish their degree quickly, and then walk away with a Master's by the time they have exhausted their eligibility.

[BillySee58]

10 hours ago, GreenBacker said:

That is correct.  He graduated in the spring (drove up to Dallas often to watch SMU workout while still attending UT) and was immediately eligible with two years to play.  There are a few in the same boat that SMU picked up.  With kids staying on campus and taking courses in the summer, it is more and more doable to finish their degree quickly, and then walk away with a Master's by the time they have exhausted their eligibility.

 

21 hours ago, keith said:

The Buchele situation confuses me.  He's listed as a Junior, so he'll play next year as well, right?  When he transferred he was listed as immediately available.  Did he already graduate from Texas?  Since he was immediately available I assume that means he was a graduate transfer, but with two years of eligibility left.  Normally we think of graduate transfers as one and done, but not in this case?  Worked out well for SMU, that's for sure.

This is not an out-of-the-ordinary case for QB grad transfers, since they often are early enrollees out of high school. Which was the case for Buechele.

He enrolled in Texas in the spring 2016 semester (graduated high school a semester early), then was at Texas for the 16-17 school year, 17-18 school year, and 18-19 school year so he was on campus for 7 full semesters, plus probably took summer classes as well. But only 3 football seasons. Joe Burrow at LSU is in the 2nd year there after graduating from Ohio State.

Edited October 26, 2019 by BillySee58

[97and03]

Plus kids often come in with AP test credits in basic subjects. 

[Mean Green Matt]

18 hours ago, untbowler said:

so they beat a good UH team on short rest, good for them, they know how to win the tight games, every ranked tea has the tight games they win during a season. 

I fully believe SMU is going to get run off the field this week at Memphis.

[Hunter Green]

20 hours ago, drex said:

I have never trusted SMU and never will.  Good for them, they are on a roll.  However, the roll might get a bit bumpy in a year or two if they are put under the microscope by the NCAA.  NCAA loves to beat up on SMU.

Deservedly so.