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Praise for Mason Fine (and how far we've come)


meangreen2016

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Yes to your good post. Since we're talking QBs, when are we going to see the freshman from Mansfield? Too lazy to look up names at the moment, but he and the QB from Manvel were very impressive when I watched them in the HS playoffs last year. Didn't Mansfield run a 10.3 100 at State last year? Love him as a QB, but any talk of a WR switch with all of that speed? Hope we do well enough at EP to get a better look at these guys (including Cade), with the new four game RS rule and Mason's knee situation.

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As much as I want to praise him for his toughness and as much shit as I'm going to get for saying this, his unwillingness to take himself out of the game could have been a deciding factor.  I don't like to play the what if game, but he was not able to operate the offense like it should have been in his condition.  He made some good plays but him keeping himself in the game, while a display of toughness, was also a display of arrogance on both the part of himself and the coaches (for not pulling  him), one that might have lost us the game.  I love Mason Fine, he is a fantastic quarterback, but he was a liability on the field, and while he put us in a position to get the last minute field goal at the end, we stalled on the previous two drives with him hobbled.  He should have taken himself out of the game or the coaches should have done it for him, end of story.

Edit: Also failed to make mention of this, it is a long season.  If him moving around on that knee made the injury worse and we lose him for more games, he did us an even worse disservice. 

Edited by peanuts104
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@risinggreen I think you're talking about Jason Bean. Freshmen. 6-3 185 so he's got the size. I have been a little curious as to why Littrell hasn't played him, but maybe he's trying to Redshirt him? Or maybe he's just not ready? No idea, but if he's not redshirting the least they could do with him right now is some designed runs instead of letting Fine get banged up even more. 

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13 minutes ago, peanuts104 said:

As much as I want to praise him for his toughness and as much shit as I'm going to get for saying this, his unwillingness to take himself out of the game could have been a deciding factor. 

100% this. I'm so proud of him having that warrior mentality, but look, we have plenty of quarterbacks that could have won us last night's game in his place. 

This is why I've said that coaching lost us last night's game, not the players. As much as I love our staff and how well they've done, you just can't play a quarterback on a bad ankle three consecutive drives down 2 points and expect magic to happen. 

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@peanuts104 This is just a legitimate question because I'm asking myself the same thing: Do you think we would still be saying Fine should have come out if Hedland makes one of the two kicks? I'm not sure, I'd like to say probably not. Then again, I'm not even sure what play Fine got hurt. 

Yeah, I agree with you. I kept thinking they could've put Shanbour in there when they got to the 40 yard line and have him run a veer with whatever RB was left. Shanbour normally gets like 7 yards a run in the games he's come in, and with a fresh set of legs against a tired La Tech defense... But again, what if? 

The main point of the post was just to highlight the fact that Mason Fine was marching the team down the field with one leg. Maybe they don't trust any of the QB's behind Fine. Seriously, maybe they are all garbage? I have been a little frustrated with how long Fine has been playing in those blow out games. I'm not sure why they haven't been giving other QBs game time in case he gets hurt.

 

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10 minutes ago, peanuts104 said:

I hope he doesn't play next week.  We shouldn't need him against UTEP.

 Will be interesting to see if he does not play what we do. I’m sure Quinn will get the start but I wonder if we start slow at the beginning if maybe Cade Pearson will get in?

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5 minutes ago, meangreen2016 said:

@peanuts104 This is just a legitimate question because I'm asking myself the same thing: Do you think we would still be saying Fine should have come out if Hedland makes one of the two kicks? I'm not sure, I'd like to say probably not. Then again, I'm not even sure what play Fine got hurt. 

Yeah, I agree with you. I kept thinking they could've put Shanbour in there when they got to the 40 yard line and have him run a veer with whatever RB was left. Shanbour normally gets like 7 yards a run in the games he's come in, and with a fresh set of legs against a tired La Tech defense... But again, what if? 

The main point of the post was just to highlight the fact that Mason Fine was marching the team down the field with one leg. Maybe they don't trust any of the QB's behind Fine. Seriously, maybe they are all garbage? I have been a little frustrated with how long Fine has been playing in those blow out games. I'm not sure why they haven't been giving other QBs game time in case he gets hurt.

This is why I hate the what if game.  There are so many things we could have done or not done toward the end.  I think the pressure kicks for Hedlund is concerning going forward.  I don't know how we're going to know how good the QB stable is behind Fine if we don't play them more.  Like largekfcbucket said, I'd be interested to see how Martin, Bean, or Pearson could do.  Quinn does not seem keen to pass the ball.  Either way, no reason to rush Mason back against UTEP.

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Just now, meangreen2016 said:

Totally. I could taste victory at one point... Anyways, as long as we get the W and Fine gets better soon I don't care who they put in. It might be time to just throw one of the new guys out there over Quinn and prepare them in case Fine goes down again. Bean seems more dual threat than Cade Pearson. 

Bean is more of a runner, Pearson is a pocket passer.  Why not play both?  I want Kason to sit for this year and learn, but I think Kason could be the heir apparent after Mason leaves, though who knows.  All the QBs are young and it's hard to speculate at this point.

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39 minutes ago, peanuts104 said:

Edit: Also failed to make mention of this, it is a long season.  If him moving around on that knee made the injury worse and we lose him for more games, he did us an even worse disservice. 

I feel confident that the training staff evaluated the injury and felt certain that he wasn't going to worsen the injury by continuing to play.  Generally speaking, trainers are pretty protective of players nowadays.  I feel like he pulled a hamstring based on how he was responding when the injury occurred, but obviously I could be wrong.

Also, Mason should get no blame whatsoever.  We should hope that every player on the team has his mentality.  It's the job of the trainers and coaches to pull a player.  My son is a freshman in high school and he just missed 2 games due to injury, but only because the trainer (and his parents) wouldn't release him to play.  He would have gone back in the game the night he was injured if he'd been allowed to do so.  

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4 minutes ago, NT93 said:

I feel confident that the training staff evaluated the injury and felt certain that he wasn't going to worsen the injury by continuing to play.  Generally speaking, trainers are pretty protective of players nowadays.  I feel like he pulled a hamstring based on how he was responding when the injury occurred, but obviously I could be wrong.

Also, Mason should get no blame whatsoever.  We should hope that every player on the team has his mentality.  It's the job of the trainers and coaches to pull a player.  My son is a freshman in high school and he just missed 2 games due to injury, but only because the trainer (and his parents) wouldn't release him to play.  He would have gone back in the game the night he was injured if he'd been allowed to do so.  

I hope you're right.

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There is no doubt that Mason is a badass and tough as nails, but if he is not 100%, he needs to rest a week. If/when we get a good lead, he needs to come out regardless. 

 

In regards to Bean, I've heard his arm is still needs work. Nothing a season with the strength and conditioning coaches can't fix. 

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Shanbour should start since he's definitely the one who knows the system way better than Bean/Martin/etc (no dig on them, but they're all still too new). I have no problem with the others coming in at some point during the game, thanks to the new rule that allows them to be in 4 games without sacrificing the redshirt. We used one game for some of them, and I don't think we'll desire their services in close games. Why not against UTEP if we have a cushion?

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2 hours ago, largekfcbucket said:

100% this. I'm so proud of him having that warrior mentality, but look, we have plenty of quarterbacks that could have won us last night's game in his place. 

This is why I've said that coaching lost us last night's game, not the players. As much as I love our staff and how well they've done, you just can't play a quarterback on a bad ankle three consecutive drives down 2 points and expect magic to happen. 

 

2 hours ago, peanuts104 said:

As much as I want to praise him for his toughness and as much shit as I'm going to get for saying this, his unwillingness to take himself out of the game could have been a deciding factor.  I don't like to play the what if game, but he was not able to operate the offense like it should have been in his condition.  He made some good plays but him keeping himself in the game, while a display of toughness, was also a display of arrogance on both the part of himself and the coaches (for not pulling  him), one that might have lost us the game.  I love Mason Fine, he is a fantastic quarterback, but he was a liability on the field, and while he put us in a position to get the last minute field goal at the end, we stalled on the previous two drives with him hobbled.  He should have taken himself out of the game or the coaches should have done it for him, end of story.

Edit: Also failed to make mention of this, it is a long season.  If him moving around on that knee made the injury worse and we lose him for more games, he did us an even worse disservice. 

Do you really believe that NT could have substituted a QB and won?  I sure don't.   You do realize that no QB has got meaningful minutes other than Fine.  The offensive line couldn't pass block their shadow, a new inexperienced QB would have been destroyed. 

The coaching staff decides who plays not the players.   A hobbled Fine was NT's best option for winning the game.  It may not have been a good decision to leave Fine in, but it sure didn't diminish NT's chances to win.   

You can certainly question the decision to not pull Fine for fear of injury, but not because NT has better options at QB.  

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14 hours ago, GrandGreen said:

 

You're inaccurate if you don't think that any of the other QBs couldn't hand the ball off 90% of the time like we did in the 4th quarter.  You're also fucking stupid if you don't think the coaches trust any of the QBs over an injured Fine. It comes down to basic shit like could he even protect himself if the pass rush got to him?  It was horrible coaching, and your defense of it shows how little you care for player health.

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10 minutes ago, peanuts104 said:

You're fucking stupid if you don't think that any of the other QBs couldn't hand the ball off 90% of the time like we did in the 4th quarter.  You're also fucking stupid if you don't think the coaches trust any of the QBs over an injured Fine. It comes down to basic shit like could he even protect himself if the pass rush got to him?  It was horrible coaching, and your defense of it shows how little you care for player health.

Are you 12?  There is no place on this board for that kind of language.  

After this post, I would not advise you to call anyone stupid.  If you can read above a third grade level, you might notice I never defended leaving Fine in the game.  Only stated he was the best option to win the game. 

 

 

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15 minutes ago, GrandGreen said:

 

Attacking my intelligence is definitely a logical farcically.  And if you don't understand that changing to Shanbour, especially in the last couple of drives with his run first mindset, it could have been the change of pace we needed to win.  I'm not saying that would have happened.  Again, it's stupid to speculate, but we have guys behind Fine that can do work at QB.  The only thing that kept him on the field was Arrogance, both on him and the coaches. 

Edit: lol I misspelled fallacy, thanks autocorret 

Edited by peanuts104
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21 minutes ago, peanuts104 said:

You're fucking stupid if you don't think that any of the other QBs couldn't hand the ball off 90% of the time like we did in the 4th quarter.  You're also fucking stupid if you don't think the coaches trust any of the QBs over an injured Fine. It comes down to basic shit like could he even protect himself if the pass rush got to him?  It was horrible coaching, and your defense of it shows how little you care for player health.

Are you 12?  There is no place on this board for that kind of language.  

After this post, I would not advise you to call anyone stupid.  If you can read above a third grade level, you might notice I never defended leaving Fine in the game.  Only stated he was the best option to win the game. 

2 minutes ago, peanuts104 said:

Attacking my intelligence is definitely a logical farcically.  And if you don't understand that changing to Shanbour, especially in the last couple of drives with his run first mindset, it could have been the change of pace we needed to win.  I'm not saying that would have happened.  Again, it's stupid to speculate, but we have guys behind Fine that can do work at QB.  The only thing that kept him on the field was Arrogance, both on him and the coaches. 

The last thing I want to do is talk football with an idiot.  

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4 minutes ago, GrandGreen said:

The last thing I want to do is talk football with an idiot.  

Avoiding the issue.  Appeal to authority?  IDK, I'm rusty on my logical fallacies, it's been a while.  Either way, you're not actually supporting your argument with anything other than calling me stupid.

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