CUSA and Sunbelt Merger About to Happen Folks

[untjim1995]

1 hour ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Sure.   But do you think settling into this hodgepodge conference would show either AAC, MWC, or whatever the Big12 leftovers turn into, that we're serious about moving up to join them?  

I'm betting a spot in this league will be open to NT for eternity.  It's not like it's a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to join.
 

I guess my view is that you set yourself into the best scenario you can that combines winning potential with cost control. While CUSA is waaayyyy better than the old SBC, we could still tighten that up and get the best of both worlds in a conference that has teams people have heard of and care about in the region, while also being able to beat them (hopefully) and travel rather inexpensively to their cities. If you can succeed at winning there and seeing increased profits, then you can hope it gets the attention of another conference that believes we would provide more to them than SMU or TCU would be able to undersell and get us a place at the table with them. Could that happen? Probably a better chance with TCU than there ever will be with SMU, but I wouldn't expect it to be much better.

What I cannot see, even though I wish the path was clear to see, is a place for UNT in one of those two conferences above us in the G5. Being blocked, blackballed, etc,,,whatever you call it, the same old reality of sharing a TV market with TCU and SMU is just a hurdle we have never come close to leaping. If that is the case, its likely that we could even be in a SBCUSA setup that doesn't include UTEP, Rice, UTSA, and MUTS. While tough to digest as UNT fans/alumni, it can only be laid at the feet of the BOR and Administration who let us flounder for these last two decades when we had the chance to surpass either SMU or TCU. In the mid 90s, TCU was pure dogshit until they spent some money and hired a proven winner in Dennis Franchione, who then left and they replaced him with his DC, Gary Patterson. We played them three times, lost all three in fairly competitive games, but we were building up into a good program, winning SBC titles in 4 straight seasons. I go back to this again, but in 2005, coming off our last SBC Championship, SI had their annual preseason rankings out of all FBS teams back then, and we were exactly one spot behind TCU. Then, we went 2-9 and the program basically began dying, while TCU finished in the top 10.

Then, when both SMU and us were both sucking so bad in the 2005-2008 timeframe, we hired Todd Dodge in 2007 from a high school for about $300K, while they paid out $2 million in 2008 to bring over June Jones from Hawaii, fresh off a BCS bowl berth. By 2009, we were finishing up another 2 win season, giving us a whopping 10-40 record in those four preceding years while playing in the Mighty Sun Belt, and SMU was winning a bowl game and beginning a run of 4 straight bowl berths. SMU hasn't had continued success, but their money and location continues to buy lots of media coverage and conference placement.

When we look back at this timeframe in the decades ahead, we are all going to realize just how big of an opportunity we blew here. SMU and TCU weren't SWC big boys anymore, like they were in the 79s and 80s, nor were they that far above us in the mid-to-late 90s and into the 00's. But we never could jump either of them in the eyes of media and conference officials. And once we went back to losing, we kept the same AD in charge, we hired poorly, and we scheduled something awful. While the 1-aa debacle of the 80's basically knocked us into a coma that appears to have been lethal, when we finally got up and at least started running again and began making some progress, we drank koolaid that was poisoned by bad leadership, poor hires, and decisions based almost solely on cost. We got no one to blame but ourselves for this predicament.

To me, if we ever move upward above where we are today, conference-wise, it will be due to overcoming some of the most stacked odds anyone could have ever beaten, from a location standpoint, a history standpoint, and a severe lack of funds as compared to other schools in our region. Miraculous is the term I would use to describe what it would take. 

[Arkstfan]

The old saying that generals try to fight the last war fits the current situation in G5.

Think about TV money. At a P5 TV can be 20% to 35% of the entire athletic budget at G5 you are looking at 4% to less than 1%. A football coach at a P5 may be making 25% or 35% of a school's TV money at a G5 it might be 400% to 700%

TV money is essentially irrelevant to the conversation now in G5.

Television now is only valuable in the exposure provided. Does the video reach people you want to recruit and people you want to turn into ticket buyers and if you are doing really well, people who vote in the polls?

The money is received is an offset for the nuisance of weeknight games and weird start times, it really isn't program operating revenue.

We look at travel the wrong way as well. There isn't much difference between a 2 hour flight and 3 hour flight, but there is a big difference in bus or airplane. There is a difference if you have to put a team in a hotel another night or have to pay for two more meals per member of the traveling party. It matters how much you are paying CDL holders to get your gear from home to the opponent. If the drive is more than 11 hours, you have to have two drivers.

Travel when it is to a place you recruit students or student-athletes or places where you can connect with a decent number of alumni or places where the opponent is nationally significant or will draw interest at home is a good expenditure, it benefits the school and the program. Travel that doesn't do that is simply a line item in the budget in the expense column.

The biggest thing is storyline.

What is the story that makes the casual fan show up?

Generally that is playing a rival, but the constant churn of conference lineups kills rivalries before they blossom. Is this a critical game for the conference title (unfortunately most games are not a big factor in the race). Not a rival not for the title, well there is in-state pride battling a team in the state, or state pride taking on a school from a neighboring state. Get past that and you are left with maybe the school has a big enough brand to draw fans.

One of the largest crowds AState has had was against MTSU. Not so much a rivalry that the casual fan would notice but it was Arkansas vs. Tennessee (which matters in NE Arkansas) and it was winner takes all. The team that wins takes the conference. The place was packed even though it was a December weekend.

Lacking those storylines, conference opponents are widgets. Utterly interchangeable. If you swapped Charlotte for Georgia State on our schedule, our fans won't notice. Louisiana Lafayette for Old Dominion? They'd notice. It's an old series marked by a lot of close games (last game came down to a video of review of whether our QB was down before the pitch that led to the apparent and over-ruled game winning TD) most of the games have been televised. Our fans are aware of the Cajuns, they aren't a widget. Our fans care about App State but only because the games have been significant. One of us starts sucking and it becomes a widget.

That's really what is at stake when you have an anonymous CUSA AD stating that CUSA's financial model is unsustainable.

Too much of the travel cost isn't advancing the program, it's a line item expense. Too many games don't have a storyline to hook the casual fan.

The 14 way split of the money minimizes its value, the logical thing would be go to 16 or 18 to regionalize things more but the CFP distribution scheme undermines that.

Schools like ODU apparently think if they replace a trip to North Texas with App State that they not only save money but the trip advances their program's goals. A trip to FAU advances Marshall's goals but does it advance UNT's or UTSA's?

I don't think it is an accident that the Sun Belt opted to stay at 10 football members while CUSA has 14 and probably not an accident that the Sun Belt listened to Eastern Kentucky and then picked up the phone and called Coastal Carolina.

The handwriting is on the wall. CUSA's two year TV deal expires after this season. If it is renewed for two more years, it expires the same time as the Sun Belt's deal.

What happens at that point? Maybe nothing. Maybe the conference bid out their TV in a joint operation. Maybe they shuffle the membership and start focusing on regional distribution in addition to national to increase exposure in places they recruit athletically and academically and have alumni.

 

[MeanGreenMailbox aka TFLF]

3 hours ago, untjim1995 said:

I think the BOR and administration are wanting to spend enough to be a G5 program--but that is the hard part because you have other G5s in the state that are higher up the foodchain who do spend lots of $$$ in SMU and UH. And spending money without a guarantee has never really been something we have done much of before.

The reality to all of this is the tv revenue being reduced so noticeably. Now, you have three ways to help your bottom line--control spending, increase attendance, and play whore games. Geographically, we can accomplish the first two ways, for sure. And number three has been tried and done infinitum over the decades.

If the SBCUSA comes to pass, combining into four separate divisions, that won't be the worst thing that could happen here. If the MWC and AAC won't take us, particularly when the Big XII falls apart, then we are going to have to do something to control costs better. Regionalization will do that, and if certain teams won't play in a division with another team, than the SBCUSA model can probably accommodate this.

If we had given the MWC any reason to believe we could have added value there, I still don't believe our fanbase or administration would have gone for it. Its too bad, but the fact will always remain that you can get people to go to watch us play Boise State, AFA, Colorado State, and Fresno State at Apogee over F_Us, ODU, and Charlotte. You can get people to watch us play SDSU, UNM, or UNLV in basketball at the Super Pit, too. But that's not what the majority wants, so it was never gonna get accepted even if they offered us, sadly.

The basketball is way better, for sure.  And, the football programs more recognizable. 

I'm for a more regional alignment of school in the C-USA and Sun Belt.  However, if it come down to styaing in the C-USA and taking an invite to the MWC, we'd be crazy not to move. 

I disagree with those who say MWC is no longer a move up.

The main problem, as always, if that decades of neglect have brought us to this.  The last AD did a good job of upgrading the facilities.  We'll see if the new AD can bring in coaches that win consistently.  We'll need a combination of both - plus, luck and prayers - to move up even to MWC or AAC.

10 minutes ago, Arkstfan said:

The old saying that generals try to fight the last war fits the current situation in G5.

Think about TV money. At a P5 TV can be 20% to 35% of the entire athletic budget at G5 you are looking at 4% to less than 1%. A football coach at a P5 may be making 25% or 35% of a school's TV money at a G5 it might be 400% to 700%

TV money is essentially irrelevant to the conversation now in G5.

Television now is only valuable in the exposure provided. Does the video reach people you want to recruit and people you want to turn into ticket buyers and if you are doing really well, people who vote in the polls?

The money is received is an offset for the nuisance of weeknight games and weird start times, it really isn't program operating revenue.

We look at travel the wrong way as well. There isn't much difference between a 2 hour flight and 3 hour flight, but there is a big difference in bus or airplane. There is a difference if you have to put a team in a hotel another night or have to pay for two more meals per member of the traveling party. It matters how much you are paying CDL holders to get your gear from home to the opponent. If the drive is more than 11 hours, you have to have two drivers.

Travel when it is to a place you recruit students or student-athletes or places where you can connect with a decent number of alumni or places where the opponent is nationally significant or will draw interest at home is a good expenditure, it benefits the school and the program. Travel that doesn't do that is simply a line item in the budget in the expense column.

The biggest thing is storyline.

What is the story that makes the casual fan show up?

Generally that is playing a rival, but the constant churn of conference lineups kills rivalries before they blossom. Is this a critical game for the conference title (unfortunately most games are not a big factor in the race). Not a rival not for the title, well there is in-state pride battling a team in the state, or state pride taking on a school from a neighboring state. Get past that and you are left with maybe the school has a big enough brand to draw fans.

One of the largest crowds AState has had was against MTSU. Not so much a rivalry that the casual fan would notice but it was Arkansas vs. Tennessee (which matters in NE Arkansas) and it was winner takes all. The team that wins takes the conference. The place was packed even though it was a December weekend.

Lacking those storylines, conference opponents are widgets. Utterly interchangeable. If you swapped Charlotte for Georgia State on our schedule, our fans won't notice. Louisiana Lafayette for Old Dominion? They'd notice. It's an old series marked by a lot of close games (last game came down to a video of review of whether our QB was down before the pitch that led to the apparent and over-ruled game winning TD) most of the games have been televised. Our fans are aware of the Cajuns, they aren't a widget. Our fans care about App State but only because the games have been significant. One of us starts sucking and it becomes a widget.

That's really what is at stake when you have an anonymous CUSA AD stating that CUSA's financial model is unsustainable.

Too much of the travel cost isn't advancing the program, it's a line item expense. Too many games don't have a storyline to hook the casual fan.

The 14 way split of the money minimizes its value, the logical thing would be go to 16 or 18 to regionalize things more but the CFP distribution scheme undermines that.

Schools like ODU apparently think if they replace a trip to North Texas with App State that they not only save money but the trip advances their program's goals. A trip to FAU advances Marshall's goals but does it advance UNT's or UTSA's?

I don't think it is an accident that the Sun Belt opted to stay at 10 football members while CUSA has 14 and probably not an accident that the Sun Belt listened to Eastern Kentucky and then picked up the phone and called Coastal Carolina.

The handwriting is on the wall. CUSA's two year TV deal expires after this season. If it is renewed for two more years, it expires the same time as the Sun Belt's deal.

What happens at that point? Maybe nothing. Maybe the conference bid out their TV in a joint operation. Maybe they shuffle the membership and start focusing on regional distribution in addition to national to increase exposure in places they recruit athletically and academically and have alumni.

 

Excellent insight as always.  Thank you.  Particularly the splitting money angle.  It's one of the reason I favor a nine or 10 team regional conference over a 14 or 16 team conference...full of schools with no prayer of making much money to split in the first place.

Miss the hard-hitting UNT-Arkie St games as well.

[wardly]

It will probably take a miracle to merge conferences, but hey, its Easter.

[Wag Tag]

Only way MWC makes sense is to have an east- west division with a championship game!

[Cerebus]

17 hours ago, Arkstfan said:

What happens at that point? Maybe nothing. Maybe the conference bid out their TV in a joint operation. Maybe they shuffle the membership and start focusing on regional distribution in addition to national to increase exposure in places they recruit athletically and academically and have alumni.

 

IMHO, the best realistic thing that could happen.  One becomes an southeastern league, the other is a Texas + border states league.  

Something along those lines.  

[Arkstfan]

40 minutes ago, Cerebus said:

IMHO, the best realistic thing that could happen.  One becomes an southeastern league, the other is a Texas + border states league.  

Something along those lines.  

Thing is Fox is perfect for that. Texas, Arkansas and Louisiana default to the same feed unless there are conflicting games or blackout rules in place. In Little Rock they slide the Fox South feed in when the Grizzlies play but outside of that we get the Fox Dallas feed for the Stars and Mavericks. Many cable systems just run the Fox Dallas feed and put the Grizz on an alternate channel. They take the Fox Midwest feed for Cardinals games on an alternate.

An Ark-La-Tex league is really built for the old Fox SW region.

[Wag Tag]

18 hours ago, Arkstfan said:

The old saying that generals try to fight the last war fits the current situation in G5.

Think about TV money. At a P5 TV can be 20% to 35% of the entire athletic budget at G5 you are looking at 4% to less than 1%. A football coach at a P5 may be making 25% or 35% of a school's TV money at a G5 it might be 400% to 700%

TV money is essentially irrelevant to the conversation now in G5.

Television now is only valuable in the exposure provided. Does the video reach people you want to recruit and people you want to turn into ticket buyers and if you are doing really well, people who vote in the polls?

The money is received is an offset for the nuisance of weeknight games and weird start times, it really isn't program operating revenue.

We look at travel the wrong way as well. There isn't much difference between a 2 hour flight and 3 hour flight, but there is a big difference in bus or airplane. There is a difference if you have to put a team in a hotel another night or have to pay for two more meals per member of the traveling party. It matters how much you are paying CDL holders to get your gear from home to the opponent. If the drive is more than 11 hours, you have to have two drivers.

Travel when it is to a place you recruit students or student-athletes or places where you can connect with a decent number of alumni or places where the opponent is nationally significant or will draw interest at home is a good expenditure, it benefits the school and the program. Travel that doesn't do that is simply a line item in the budget in the expense column.

The biggest thing is storyline.

What is the story that makes the casual fan show up?

Generally that is playing a rival, but the constant churn of conference lineups kills rivalries before they blossom. Is this a critical game for the conference title (unfortunately most games are not a big factor in the race). Not a rival not for the title, well there is in-state pride battling a team in the state, or state pride taking on a school from a neighboring state. Get past that and you are left with maybe the school has a big enough brand to draw fans.

One of the largest crowds AState has had was against MTSU. Not so much a rivalry that the casual fan would notice but it was Arkansas vs. Tennessee (which matters in NE Arkansas) and it was winner takes all. The team that wins takes the conference. The place was packed even though it was a December weekend.

Lacking those storylines, conference opponents are widgets. Utterly interchangeable. If you swapped Charlotte for Georgia State on our schedule, our fans won't notice. Louisiana Lafayette for Old Dominion? They'd notice. It's an old series marked by a lot of close games (last game came down to a video of review of whether our QB was down before the pitch that led to the apparent and over-ruled game winning TD) most of the games have been televised. Our fans are aware of the Cajuns, they aren't a widget. Our fans care about App State but only because the games have been significant. One of us starts sucking and it becomes a widget.

That's really what is at stake when you have an anonymous CUSA AD stating that CUSA's financial model is unsustainable.

Too much of the travel cost isn't advancing the program, it's a line item expense. Too many games don't have a storyline to hook the casual fan.

The 14 way split of the money minimizes its value, the logical thing would be go to 16 or 18 to regionalize things more but the CFP distribution scheme undermines that.

Schools like ODU apparently think if they replace a trip to North Texas with App State that they not only save money but the trip advances their program's goals. A trip to FAU advances Marshall's goals but does it advance UNT's or UTSA's?

I don't think it is an accident that the Sun Belt opted to stay at 10 football members while CUSA has 14 and probably not an accident that the Sun Belt listened to Eastern Kentucky and then picked up the phone and called Coastal Carolina.

The handwriting is on the wall. CUSA's two year TV deal expires after this season. If it is renewed for two more years, it expires the same time as the Sun Belt's deal.

What happens at that point? Maybe nothing. Maybe the conference bid out their TV in a joint operation. Maybe they shuffle the membership and start focusing on regional distribution in addition to national to increase exposure in places they recruit athletically and academically and have alumni.

 

As TV markets get less important filling tha stadium is going to be key. So do you analyze a school by how their fans travel? I would bet UNT is one of the best attended G5 games for SMU. I wonder what was the largest visitor attended game we have had at Ap? Houston?

Edited April 13, 2017 by Wag Tag

[Cerebus]

1 hour ago, Arkstfan said:

An Ark-La-Tex league is really built for the old Fox SW region.

If that worked out it would be gravy.  

At this point I just hope that CUSA/SBC leadership understands it better to work together, the free money from TV heaven is over.  

[untjim1995]

2 hours ago, Cerebus said:

If that worked out it would be gravy.  

At this point I just hope that CUSA/SBC leadership understands it better to work together, the free money from TV heaven is over.  

I think they know this has to be done sooner rather than later. Like Arkstfan said, regional tv would like this kind of league, since it gets TV sets in Little Rock, Hotsprings, Monroe, Shreveport, DFW, El Paso, San Antonio, Austin, Houston,Lafayette, and New Orleans to watch these SBCUSA teams here in the Arklatex region. I can see Sam Houston and SFA moving up, too, so you get their alumni in East Texas and around Houston to join in, too.

NMSU, La Tech, ULL, Rice, Texas State, and SFA

UTEP, Arky State, ULM, UNT, UTSA, and SHSU

Every division plays each other, plus you play one rival every year from the other division (listed above/below in the names), plus two other non-divisional conference mates every year.

 

[MeanGreenTexan]

20 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

I think they know this has to be done sooner rather than later. Like Arkstfan said, regional tv would like this kind of league, since it gets TV sets in Little Rock, Hotsprings, Monroe, Shreveport, DFW, El Paso, San Antonio, Austin, Houston,Lafayette, and New Orleans to watch these SBCUSA teams here in the Arklatex region. I can see Sam Houston and SFA moving up, too, so you get their alumni in East Texas and around Houston to join in, too.

NMSU, La Tech, ULL, Rice, Texas State, and SFA

UTEP, Arky State, ULM, UNT, UTSA, and SHSU

Every division plays each other, plus you play one rival every year from the other division (listed above/below in the names), plus two other non-divisional conference mates every year.

 

**rip Charlie Murphy.**

GET YOURSELF TOGETHER MAN!!

Look at the conference you're describing!

This is a drastic step down from what we have now, and a monumental leap down from the MWC.  

 

 

[UNTFan23]

24 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

I think they know this has to be done sooner rather than later. Like Arkstfan said, regional tv would like this kind of league, since it gets TV sets in Little Rock, Hotsprings, Monroe, Shreveport, DFW, El Paso, San Antonio, Austin, Houston,Lafayette, and New Orleans to watch these SBCUSA teams here in the Arklatex region. I can see Sam Houston and SFA moving up, too, so you get their alumni in East Texas and around Houston to join in, too.

NMSU, La Tech, ULL, Rice, Texas State, and SFA

UTEP, Arky State, ULM, UNT, UTSA, and SHSU

Every division plays each other, plus you play one rival every year from the other division (listed above/below in the names), plus two other non-divisional conference mates every year.

Why do we need to bring up more FCS schools? Is it just to get to 12 so the conference can have a FB Championship game?

[untjim1995]

2 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

**rip Charlie Murphy.**

GET YOURSELF TOGETHER MAN!!

Look at the conference you're describing!

This is a drastic step down from what we have now, and a monumental leap down from the MWC.  

 

 

We've been over this: The MWC doesn't want us and our fans don't want the MWC, no matter how much you and I wish that were different on both cases.

 

2 minutes ago, UNTFan23 said:

Why do we need to bring up more FCS schools? Is it just to get to 12 so the conference can have a FB Championship game?

Don't have to go up to 12, but that seems to work well as a number to play divisional rivals. I just see the time coming when the lower G5s and the top FCS schools are in a new division of play, that's why I brought those two schools up...

[MeanGreenTexan]

1 minute ago, untjim1995 said:

We've been over this: The MWC doesn't want us and our fans don't want the MWC, no matter how much you and I wish that were different on both cases.

 

You sure?   Has anyone in the AD approached them to see if that's true?   I bet Smatresk would still have some buddies over there to work with... kinda like Rawlins helped us get into C-USA.

[UNTFan23]

2 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

You sure?   Has anyone in the AD approached them to see if that's true?   I bet Smatresk would still have some buddies over there to work with... kinda like Rawlins helped us get into C-USA.

It might make sense for our football program to go to the MWC, but what about all our other sports? Do we need to send our volleyball team halfway across the country to California?

[untjim1995]

6 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

You sure?   Has anyone in the AD approached them to see if that's true?   I bet Smatresk would still have some buddies over there to work with... kinda like Rawlins helped us get into C-USA.

MGT, they saw BYU, Utah, and TCU leave in 2012, leaving them with no Utah or Texas teams. They added Utah State to make up for the losses of the Utes and Cougars, but decided that San Jose State was a better fit for them than getting back into the same market they had before with TCU, but with a much bigger alumni base and student body. Instead, they didn't even look our way.

And Cerebus, who is often a voice of reason around here and seems to have the pulse of the fanbase better than most, echoes the same sentiment of many others here, that they don't want to go out west to play. They like playing teams that are easy to travel to and getting to play SMU in a series--literally, that's al that matters to the majority of the fanbase here. And read the post above to see my point being proven...

 

2 minutes ago, UNTFan23 said:

It might make sense for our football program to go to the MWC, but what about all our other sports? Do we need to send our volleyball team halfway across the country to California?

Versus sending it to Virginia and Florida??

Edited April 13, 2017 by untjim1995

[UNTFan23]

1 minute ago, untjim1995 said:

Versus sending it to Virginia and Florida??

It's easier to travel east than west. A 7:00 PM Pacific start time is a 9:00 PM Central start time.

[MeanGreenTexan]

1 minute ago, UNTFan23 said:

It might make sense for our football program to go to the MWC, but what about all our other sports? Do we need to send our volleyball team halfway across the country to California?

Yes.   Because Football/basketball are the money makers.  And MWC is decidedly the better conference for both.   UNT has to demonstrate we're serious about this.  If we can prove the fans/big-$ boosters/admin/students will step up (Students already have.  Admin seems to be on the road), for UNT to have the chance to play with better-perceived schools, and funding olympic sports' road trips, then maybe we'll be taken seriously when the big 12 breaks up.

[UNTFan23]

Just now, MeanGreenTexan said:

Yes.   Because Football/basketball are the money makers.  And MWC is decidedly the better conference for both.   UNT has to demonstrate we're serious about this.  If we can prove the fans/big-$ boosters/admin/students will step up (Students already have.  Admin seems to be on the road), for UNT to have the chance to play with better-perceived schools, and funding olympic sports' road trips, then maybe we'll be taken seriously when the big 12 breaks up.

That's a pretty big gamble. All I can say it better pan out given you're talking about adding millions each year in travel expenses for a perceived better conference, especially if there are no other Texas schools added to the MWC.

[untjim1995]

4 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Yes.   Because Football/basketball are the money makers.  And MWC is decidedly the better conference for both.   UNT has to demonstrate we're serious about this.  If we can prove the fans/big-$ boosters/admin/students will step up (Students already have.  Admin seems to be on the road), for UNT to have the chance to play with better-perceived schools, and funding olympic sports' road trips, then maybe we'll be taken seriously when the big 12 breaks up.

I cannot agree with you more...and its clearly the minority view around here. Hell, there were many posters here who argued to "Build the Belt" over playing out west in the MWC ever again...

Maybe they are all correct, but I just don't see how playing SBCUSA teams is anything better than the MWC, but I get that its more expensive for travel and that there may be a game or two that start late. Somehow, I think I'd be more interested in a football game at Boise State at 9:00 or a basketball game at UNLV at 9:30 than I ever will be for a 6:00 kickoff against F_U or a 5:00 tipoff against Charlotte...

[MeanGreenTexan]

10 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

I cannot agree with you more...and its clearly the minority view around here. Hell, there were many posters here who argued to "Build the Belt" over playing out west in the MWC ever again...

Maybe they are all correct, but I just don't see how playing SBCUSA teams is anything better than the MWC, but I get that its more expensive for travel and that there may be a game or two that start late. Somehow, I think I'd be more interested in a football game at Boise State at 9:00 or a basketball game at UNLV at 9:30 than I ever will be for a 6:00 kickoff against F_U or a 5:00 tipoff against Charlotte...

Heck, SDSU, COSt, AFA... these are all more attractive.   Plus, I bet our teams wouldn't mind jaunts to Hawaii every once in a while.   Crazy-expensive, yes.  Worth it?  Probably.

And @UNTFan23, you're absolutely right.  It's a gamble for sure.   But, like I said before, I bet this "SBCUSA" deal will always be around for us.  It's the 'comfortable' place to land.

[untjim1995]

2 minutes ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

Heck, SDSU, COSt, AFA... these are all more attractive.   Plus, I bet our teams wouldn't mind jaunts to Hawaii every once in a while.   Crazy-expensive, yes.  Worth it?  Probably.

And @UNTFan23, you're absolutely right.  It's a gamble for sure.   But, like I said before, I bet this "SBCUSA" deal will always be around for us.  It's the 'comfortable' place to land.

If it provides easy games to travel to, and it doesn't cost us a game against SMU, then that is what the UNT fan wants. RV knew that all too well...

[wardly]

In a perfect world I would like a 10 school Ark-La-Tex conference playing a round robin, which would allow for 4 O.C.S.games per year., and no pseudo championship game like the Big Twelve plans to employ. However, I can only come up with 5 Texas schools[  no Southland Conference members need apply],New Mexico State, Arkansas State, and ULL.We don't want ULM, and I would bet that La.Tech. would move East in order to play in a Southeastern conference spin off.So. Miss and UAB would be non starters, so I don't know how reshuffling the deck gets us 10 universities.

[97and03]

23 hours ago, MeanGreenTexan said:

**rip Charlie Murphy.**

 

Too soon. :(

[shootermcgavin44]

On 4/10/2017 at 0:15 PM, UNTFan23 said:

So we can enjoy 9:00 game start times? No thanks!

Lame