How long will students put up with paying for nothing?

[GrandGreen]

13 minutes ago, UNTFan23 said:

Softball record:

Record: 15-11 Home: 8-4 Away: 3-4 Neutral: 4-3 C-USA: 1-5

They're not killing it in conference play right now but there are currently above the .500 mark, which is more than what our Men's Basketball team can say.

Indoor Track and Field:

Men - Finished 4th (out of 10 teams) in the conference tournament

Women - Finished 4th (out of 10 teams) in the conference tournament

Women's track didn't come in close to fourth.  Track is bad but selling half a football field as a facility for recruiting has got to be tough.  Softball is doing better than expected overall after last year's exodus, but there are still a lot of questions.  Volleyball was ok last year, but they had the best player in the conference who is now gone; so we will have to see.  Swimming is mediocre and apparently took a step back with the new coaching staff.  Men's golf is good and women's awful.   Soccer keeps status as best sport at NT.  Tennis program is great compared to before Lama as coach.  

[Aldo]

2 hours ago, UNTFan23 said:

We have programs that are doing fine -- Soccer, Softball, Track. Yeah, they're not sexy like Football and Basketball but they aren't trolling the bottom like some programs currently are.

You kill the athletic fee and suddenly college athletics at North Texas is in danger of extinction.

 

1 hour ago, Army of Dad said:

Soccer sure, but you might want to look into the softball record before you say they are doing fine. Track, uh, are they good?

First off, I don't want to kill the athletic fee. Overreaction. Students shouldn't suffer over something they aren't in charge of. That's like saying, cut all work study scholarships due to UNT's mismanagement of $70-80 million.

Hedlund was hired back in, 1990 as men's assistant and 1995 as women's first head coach.

I'll give credit where credit is due.

Oh and currently football and basketball aren't sexy

[UNTFan23]

1 hour ago, Army of Dad said:

They were 19-31 last year and 11-12 in conference play.

It may be semantics, but awful winning percentage last season and below .500 conference play last year and (so far) this year isn't what I would characterize as doing 'fine'.

Track 4th in conference would be 'fine', IMO.

I don't follow many of the ancillary sports. All I see is the occasional sports blurb like the Baylor upset and assume things are doing okay. Still, killing the athletics fee is a death sentence for practically all sports North Texas offers.

[FirefightnRick]

5 minutes ago, UNTFan23 said:

I don't follow many of the ancillary sports.

And neither does hardly anyone else.

 

Rick

[Ben Gooding]

28 minutes ago, UNTFan23 said:

I don't follow many of the ancillary sports. All I see is the occasional sports blurb like the Baylor upset and assume things are doing okay. Still, killing the athletics fee is a death sentence for practically all sports North Texas offers.

That's kind of the point. 

[Matt from A700]

The students will never demand greater, because too many have already stopped caring or look at the teams for a good laugh. That's why I keep saying the more the students get informed, the greater chance we have of getting rid of RV and Benford.

[UTSA Fan]

Hey 90, I saw the locked thread. Next season I'm interested in the game. Let me know. I know it's a year away, but I've tried dealing with the ticket office in the past and they're brutal. Thanks.

[Ben Gooding]

4 minutes ago, UTSA Fan said:

Hey 90, I saw the locked thread. Next season I'm interested in the game. Let me know. I know it's a year away, but I've tried dealing with the ticket office in the past and they're brutal. Thanks.

Why do ppl even bother with the ticket office. We average below 50% capacity. There is plenty of room. 

[UNT90]

29 minutes ago, UTSA Fan said:

Hey 90, I saw the locked thread. Next season I'm interested in the game. Let me know. I know it's a year away, but I've tried dealing with the ticket office in the past and they're brutal. Thanks.

Maybe I could open my own UNT ticket exchange, where fans could go and get decent service (it doesn't have to be great service. Low bar and all). 

Thoughts?

[UTSA Fan]

1 hour ago, Ben Gooding said:

Why do ppl even bother with the ticket office. We average below 50% capacity. There is plenty of room. 

Your post may have been tongue in cheek, but to answer your inquiry. I live out of town and want to have my travel, lodging, tickets, etc. Resolved for a smooth trip to maximize my time there. It kind of sucks calling the UTSA ticket office for away games to UNT when I would like for the $ to go to UNT (or whatever metric used to track support). 

[UNT15]

12 hours ago, UNTFan23 said:

Softball record:

Record: 15-11 Home: 8-4 Away: 3-4 Neutral: 4-3 C-USA: 1-5

They're not killing it in conference play right now but there are currently above the .500 mark, which is more than what our Men's Basketball team can say.

Indoor Track and Field:

Men - Finished 4th (out of 10 teams) in the conference tournament

Women - Finished 4th (out of 10 teams) in the conference tournament

Men = T4 (out of 10 teams); Women = 10th (out of 13 teams)

[Army of Dad]

7 hours ago, UNT15 said:

Men = T4 (out of 10 teams); Women = 10th (out of 13 teams)

So, not 'fine'.

[untjim1995]

I have said this for years. When we paid $78 million dollars for Apogee, it was with a promise from the AD that we would schedule better and be able to have more home games, as well as additional revenues for the athletic department to use. So far, in the 5 seasons we have had Apogee, we have had two 5-home game seasons, where the only OOC game was a FCS team (TX Southern and Portland St.), our FBS OOC opponents have been UH, Indiana in Year 1, Idaho (barely) and Ball State in Year 3, and SMU in Year 4. We play SMU again in 2016. We also have played/scheduled great programs that really bring in the fans like Nicholls State, Butt-Cookman, Lamar, Incarnate Word, and Abilene Christian. We watched 17 people pony up to buyout DMac's monstrosity of a contract for over $2 million, but the "increased" revenues couldn't get us rid of the mens basketball coach, who gets a 5th try to have a winning season here.

When we get drop-kicked back down to the new I-aa level, I sure as hell wouldn't want to be in leadership at UNT and have to answer as to why we put all of that money on the backs of the kids who go to school when the previous shithole of a stadium more than adequately housed the fans for games like those we have scheduled. I just don't know how anyone can justify that expenditure and ongoing fee with the results that the university has given. It certainly hasn't raised any value for the school or the degree its alums have earned. I can guarantee you, that if a vote is given to the students to recall this fee, it will get overwhelmingly voted to be repealed. The only reason it passed the first time was because of the stealth campaign that UNTFlyer brilliantly led. Even he seems to know now that it was a colossal waste of energy for what has come from getting a brand new stadium, which is a damn shame. Apogee is one of the absolute finest football stadiums in the G5, if not even above that level, too.

[TIgreen01]

I don't like this thread and I don't like where UNT90 is taking things.  @UNT90--we are ALL frustrated and sick of the crap, but you need a break from this.  What are you trying to do here?  Incite a student led revolt that kills off our AD for good??  Enough is enough.  

[UNT90]

2 hours ago, TIgreen01 said:

I don't like this thread and I don't like where UNT90 is taking things.  @UNT90--we are ALL frustrated and sick of the crap, but you need a break from this.  What are you trying to do here?  Incite a student led revolt that kills off our AD for good??  Enough is enough.  

Nope, just telling you what is coming. How long would you pay for something when you continually got nothing out of it? Don't you think the students, especially certain factions of them, will feel the same way? 

One of the main arguments against the athletics fee was "we suck at sports, why charge us more for something we suck at." The rebut was "well, we suck because we don't have the funding or facilities to field competitive teams."

Flash forward to 7 years later. New stadium, one of the best funded programs in our conference, and we still suck at every sport that matters. Not only that, but our leaders are ok with sucking at every sport that matters.

How do you rebut that argument now? How do you answer the "look, we tried it your way and it obviously didn't and won't work." 

Can you think of one? Because I sure can't.

[GTWT]

18 hours ago, UNT90 said:

Nope, just telling you what is coming. How long would you pay for something when you continually got nothing out of it? Don't you think the students, especially certain factions of them, will feel the same way? 

One of the main arguments against the athletics fee was "we suck at sports, why charge us more for something we suck at." The rebut was "well, we suck because we don't have the funding or facilities to field competitive teams."

Flash forward to 7 years later. New stadium, one of the best funded programs in our conference, and we still suck at every sport that matters. Not only that, but our leaders are ok with sucking at every sport that matters.

How do you rebut that argument now? How do you answer the "look, we tried it your way and it obviously didn't and won't work." 

Can you think of one? Because I sure can't.

UNT90 - Student leader.

[UNT90]

Just now, GTWT said:

UNT90 - Student leader.

GTWT - RV lacky. 

[GTWT]

4 minutes ago, UNT90 said:

GTWT - RV lacky. 

UNT90 - rapier wit

[GreenTexan13]

22 hours ago, TIgreen01 said:

I don't like this thread and I don't like where UNT90 is taking things.  @UNT90--we are ALL frustrated and sick of the crap, but you need a break from this.  What are you trying to do here?  Incite a student led revolt that kills off our AD for good??  Enough is enough.  

He's just more expressive then a lot of the people who see right through RV's bull. Someone already mentioned this, but I don't think it's fair to the other sports like soccer, track, softball to cut an athletic program just because it lacks in the 2 major sports department. Granted, that it isn't the most prideful thing to say that your school is a powerhouse in women's soccer. But they certainly earn the right to that athletic fee...

Besides... If we kill off the athletic program, y'all know they are just going to put RV somewhere else at the university. He could be the next UNT prez?...

[UNT90]

27 minutes ago, GreenTexan13 said:

He's just more expressive then a lot of the people who see right through RV's bull. Someone already mentioned this, but I don't think it's fair to the other sports like soccer, track, softball to cut an athletic program just because it lacks in the 2 major sports department. Granted, that it isn't the most prideful thing to say that your school is a powerhouse in women's soccer. But they certainly earn the right to that athletic fee...

Besides... If we kill off the athletic program, y'all know they are just going to put RV somewhere else at the university. He could be the next UNT prez?...

I'm not advocating for it, I'm just telling you what is going to happen if Football wins 3 or less games this year. 

My hope is that students would protest in front of the AD building for the removal of a terrible AD, but students who care about athletics normally aren't the protesting type. 

[untjim1995]

On ‎3‎/‎23‎/‎2016 at 2:04 PM, UNT90 said:

I'm not advocating for it, I'm just telling you what is going to happen if Football wins 3 or less games this year. 

My hope is that students would protest in front of the AD building for the removal of a terrible AD, but students who care about athletics normally aren't the protesting type. 

Those students won't protest to get rid of the athletic director...they will protest to get rid of the athletic fee.  If that fee ever gets voted on again in a different referendum to get rid of it, you can kiss FBS UNT football officially goodbye. All but about a few percent of the student body and alumni either don't care about UNT sports or openly loathe it. They won't continue to go quietly along with this if we keep posting more 3 or less wins in a season, especially with "announced" crowds that don't even average half of the capacity.

Eventually, if we don't start winning consistently, as in more than just one winning season in 10+, those anti-athletic voices are going to be ready to pounce on this. This will be year 5 of Apogee, yet we host teams and crowds that Fouts in its decrepit state could EASILY host.

It will be so unbelievably ironic if Lee Jackson somehow was forced to resign for being the chancellor at the time that this fee was placed on the students. Incredibly large and embarrassing accounting fiasco on your watch? Yep, here in Denton, you get an extension. Never paid a damn bit of attention to athletics nor acted as if you even care about it, but somehow, miraculously, a SGA member stealthily runs a campaign that passes to place an athletics fee on students to build a new stadium, on your watch? Yep, your ass is canned, Dallas Lee...unless he actually tells the truth and admits he hates the fee tremendously.

 

 

 

[UNT90]

5 minutes ago, untjim1995 said:

Those students won't protest to get rid of the athletic director...they will protest to get rid of the athletic fee.  If that fee ever gets voted on again in a different referendum to get rid of it, you can kiss FBS UNT football officially goodbye. All but about a few percent of the student body and alumni either don't care about UNT sports or openly loathe it. They won't continue to go quietly along with this if we keep posting more 3 or less wins in a season, especially with "announced" crowds that don't even average half of the capacity.

Eventually, if we don't start winning consistently, as in more than just one winning season in 10+, those anti-athletic voices are going to be ready to pounce on this. This will be year 5 of Apogee, yet we host teams and crowds that Fouts in its decrepit state could EASILY host.

It will be so unbelievably ironic if Lee Jackson somehow was forced to resign for being the chancellor at the time that this fee was placed on the students. Incredibly large and embarrassing accounting fiasco on your watch? Yep, here in Denton, you get an extension. Never paid a damn bit of attention to athletics nor acted as if you even care about it, but somehow, miraculously, a SGA member stealthily runs a campaign that passes to place an athletics fee on students to build a new stadium, on your watch? Yep, your ass is canned, Dallas Lee...unless he actually tells the truth and admits he hates the fee tremendously.

 

 

 

Of course he does. I think he was stunned when it actually passed, because he sure as hell weakened it when it went through the state legislature. 

@flyonthewall should be bowing at the feet of UNTFlyer for that purty stadium that no one goes into thanks to his little buddy. Instead, he wants to give credit to RV for staying the F out of the vote. Credit for doing nothing. Only at UNT.

[UNTFan23]

It would be devastating to not only the athletic department but also the school as a whole to eliminate the fee given so much of the athletic fee funds are tied to bond payments for Apogee stadium.  I'd guess the naming rights (and whatever money we're collecting from that agreement) would also be at risk given I doubt Apogee would want to have a stadium with their name attached to it sitting empty year after year.  Odds are the students would end up having to pay more as I doubt the school could find enough donors to make up any payment shortfalls for the bond payments.  That means the school would have to divert some revenue from other projects to those bond payments so long as those projects are not funded by any tax-payer money.  That would mean some "ancillary" projects the school wants to get worked on could be delayed for a number of years until such time those funds become available.

[UNT90]

34 minutes ago, UNTFan23 said:

It would be devastating to not only the athletic department but also the school as a whole to eliminate the fee given so much of the athletic fee funds are tied to bond payments for Apogee stadium.  I'd guess the naming rights (and whatever money we're collecting from that agreement) would also be at risk given I doubt Apogee would want to have a stadium with their name attached to it sitting empty year after year.  Odds are the students would end up having to pay more as I doubt the school could find enough donors to make up any payment shortfalls for the bond payments.  That means the school would have to divert some revenue from other projects to those bond payments so long as those projects are not funded by any tax-payer money.  That would mean some "ancillary" projects the school wants to get worked on could be delayed for a number of years until such time those funds become available.

Well then, Dallas Lee should have done his job in the legislature and not had those two things tied together. He didn't. They are. 

The leadership at this university where athletics is concerned is unbelievably terrible, which makes me wonder about the other areas to which I don't pay attention. 

Oh, wait. Accounting scandal. Got it. 

Edited March 28, 2016 by UNT90

[Mike Jackson]

On March 21, 2016 at 10:35 AM, UNT90 said:

It's bad enough that you use these sports to defend RV, but you then turn around and call mediocrity success. 

Typical.

Yes, like I said before the leadership and large donors of this program are comfortable aspiring to be mediocre.  

On March 22, 2016 at 3:15 PM, TIgreen01 said:

I don't like this thread and I don't like where UNT90 is taking things.  @UNT90--we are ALL frustrated and sick of the crap, but you need a break from this.  What are you trying to do here?  Incite a student led revolt that kills off our AD for good??  Enough is enough.  

The emperor is NOT NAKED, he isn't NAKED.  UNT90 isn't doing anything.  Narrating a train wreck as it happens in front of you is not causing it.