29 replies to this topic

[Harry]

Just for comparison purposes UNT had 13 jucos on last years roster.

[Green Mean]

Aaron Rodgers was a JUCO as well before he transferred to Cal. I know that is way too much of an exception but in my estimation...JUCO or not it is about talent evaluating. If you scout well and evaluate talent thoroughly then it should not matter...college football teams get new players every year so it won't matter if they are talented and can contribute. In my estimation JUCO's can add immediate depth to a team combined with some experience and maturity.

I say you do whatever it takes to get talent in the program whether they're JUCO's or not because we're not a super big boy where we only get a long list primo 4 and 5 star recruits every off season.

[UNTLifer]

^{If D.Q. Johnson can become the "Texas Stop Sign" at one corner, then we have 4 excellent JUCO's on our team. But for everyone that succeeds, it seems there are a number like Alonzo Horton.}

[KRAM1]

Hey, I doubt that anyone here is saying that you don't find a gem of a JUCO from time to time. I am not saying that one should never sign a JUCO player...as ScreamingEagle-66 rightfully pointed out, there are those not so negative reasons for players to go the JUCO route. For me, the issue is how many and why. I'd be fine with the occasional JUCO to shore up a weak spot for a year or two while the recruited and potential (potential being the operative word here...as we have all seen "potential" not develop or leave) 4-year HS player develops and gains experience if no other players were available. JUCO players certainly have their place and I am fine when that is the case, just don't want to see a program try to base it's future on JUCO guys.

[greenminer]

Doesn't hurt that we've had so many transfers come in the last year or two.

[outoftown]

I would take the 20 best Jucos in the country over the 1201th to 1220th best HS talent any day.... ...but of course I'd take the 1-20 HS talent over the 1-20 JUCO talent even faster.

bottom line if nobody goes the JUCO route that leaves good talent to be picked up... but right now there are enough teams like Troy out there building with Jucos. Because of that I feel it is the right now the correct thing to only occasionally take JUCOs: when their upside is really big and the probability of them panning out really good. But some of those are out there

Edited by outoftown, 23 May 2012 - 12:35 PM.

[KRAM1]

but right now there are enough teams like Troy out there building with Jucos.

So, in your opinion, how long will "Troy" be building with JUCO's? And, will they have lasting success going this route in your opinion? I don't think I can point to any team with a quality long-term record over the last 20 years or so who built anything long lasting with JUCO's as a majority of their recruits. Could be wrong, of course. Just want to have your thoughts since you seem to be more positive on loading up with JUCO's than I am.

[MeanGreenTexan]

So, in your opinion, how long will "Troy" be building with JUCO's? And, will they have lasting success going this route in your opinion? I don't think I can point to any team with a quality long-term record over the last 20 years or so who built anything long lasting with JUCO's as a majority of their recruits. Could be wrong, of course. Just want to have your thoughts since you seem to be more positive on loading up with JUCO's than I am.

Didn't Snyder build up K-State with recruits from the Jayhawk conference? For a while there when K-State was really good, he was getting the pick of the litter out of that conference, and the Jayhawk conference is very highly regarded conference for football, so he was getting some really nice players every single year.

He still is. Looking at last year's class for them (Rivals), 8 of their 21 commits were JUCOs, and just glancing at the past few years, it does not appear to be a blip, rather a trend.

[outoftown]

So, in your opinion, how long will "Troy" be building with JUCO's? And, will they have lasting success going this route in your opinion? I don't think I can point to any team with a quality long-term record over the last 20 years or so who built anything long lasting with JUCO's as a majority of their recruits. Could be wrong, of course. Just want to have your thoughts since you seem to be more positive on loading up with JUCO's than I am.

I am not claiming to be that knowledgeable...neither about troy nor about the future...nor am I as positive as you describe about JUCOs.I just see it as market thing. If everybody gets very down on JUCOs they will become interesting. The truth is that NT often is rather at the back of the line to pick its High school talent.... sadly enough that don't mean we get to pick first among the JUCOs.... but if the moment should ever come when everybody abandons the Juco route (say nobody has more than 5-6 on their roster and most only 1-2) going anticyclical on JUCOs would become interesting, you could start picking up some real gems.... but right now I am quite happy with how the staff does it... better to only have a few JUCOs and a high rate of "panning out" than many and having a low rate. With JUCOs you got to hit, you don't have muchtime to adjust them to the system and form them.

Edited by outoftown, 23 May 2012 - 01:08 PM.

[KRAM1]

Didn't Snyder build up K-State with recruits from the Jayhawk conference? For a while there when K-State was really good, he was getting the pick of the litter out of that conference, and the Jayhawk conference is very highly regarded conference for football, so he was getting some really nice players every single year.

He still is. Looking at last year's class for them (Rivals), 8 of their 21 commits were JUCOs, and just glancing at the past few years, it does not appear to be a blip, rather a trend.

Indeed he did...and K-State was once the doormat of the Big 12 before Snyder. Good point. And, one good example of using JUCO's to build and sustain a program.

[KRAM1]

I am not claiming to be that knowledgeable...neither about troy nor about the future...nor am I as positive as you describe about JUCOs.I just see it as market thing. If everybody gets very down on JUCOs they will become interesting. The truth is that NT often is rather at the back of the line to pick its High school talent.... sadly enough that don't mean we get to pick first among the JUCOs.... but if the moment should ever come when everybody abandons the Juco route (say nobody has more than 5-6 on their roster and most only 1-2) going anticyclical on JUCOs would become interesting, you could start picking up some real gems.... but right now I am quite happy with how the staff does it... better to only have a few JUCOs and a high rate of "panning out" than many and having a low rate. With JUCOs you got to hit, you don't have muchtime to adjust them to the system and form them.

Good point as well...if you "hit" on a JUCO you are a hero for sure, if you miss, well it's probably worse in some respects than missing on a HS recruit. I doubt that the JUCO route will ever be abandoned. The temptation for a quick fix for a downtrodden program is just too great for some folks to pass on. I'm "good" with the Mean Green having a few JUCO's every year, just don't think it's the way to go as an overall program "builder"....in spite of the success Snyder has had at K-State.

[Green P1]

I'll take some jucos over the high school kids that keep leaving the program under Mac... I'm just saying. Another recruiting class like last year's and we'll be hurting like crazy for some jucos.

[Graddean]

Those that did not get to see John Love missed something. He was special.

[SCREAMING EAGLE-66]

Yes, and in my day, there was O.J. Simpson. And during the same time frame (mid-to-late 60's) North Texas had a Juco named John Love who did pretty well.

.
Did not realize Love was a Juco..... fits the above ....probably overlooked because was rather short...but he played football and some basketball at NT... and later the Redskins.

[SilverEagle]

.
Did not realize Love was a Juco..... fits the above ....probably overlooked because was rather short...but he played football and some basketball at NT... and later the Redskins.

John Love was about average size for a receiver in his day (5'9" X 180). I didn't know he played BB as well, but that doesn't surprise me because he was such a great athlete. I remember being impressed with his versatility. In the first game that I saw him play (homecoming 1965 vs Wichita State) he scored a touchdown and then changed shoes and kicked the extra point. He was the first, and only, football player of color that I have ever seen who kicked PAT's....and on one occasion a FG.

Oh, and just in case anyone thinks that he was only successful against MVC-like competition. That same year (1965) he got 167 receiving yards against Arkansas.

Edited by SilverEagle, 24 May 2012 - 01:30 AM.