I am against the Banner

[GrayEagle]

Thank you Harry for writing this.  It saved me from writing something similar that wouldn't have been nearly as poignant...or as well-written.

When I was a kid I used to go to a barbershop that had a prayer on the wall.  It said, "Lord, fill my mouth with worthwhile stuff and nudge me when I've said enough."  

You've said enough and your point has been well taken (or at least taken.)  RV, Smatresk, and probably the entire Board of Regents knows how displeased you are.  Adding to it is overkill and will only alienate those that you are turning to for help.  You are trying to force a decision that they do not want to make in your favor.  If they plan to act favorably the banner will have no significance.

RV's contract is up in something like eighteen months.  If you were successful in getting Rick removed it would cost the university somewhere in the vicinity of a half-million dollars.  And, do you know for a fact that some of the donors who support Villareal would continue to donate?  I doubt that.  As an example, think of Mattress Mac.  To the best of my knowledge he hasn't given another cent to North Texas since Dickey was fired.  We could be losing more millions if you are successful in your vindictiveness.

Coach Mac is gone (as he should be).  RV acted at, frankly, the right time.  Two years ago none of us thought that he was a bad hire.  We had just won a bowl game in Dallas in front of nearly 40,000 students and alums.  The GPA of his student athletes had risen tremendously.  Student participation had improved through orientation.  Dan was a good spokesman for UNT.  It was a tough year in 2014 but it would have been terrible to have fired him that year.  This year, as soon as he realized that the ox wasn't going to get out of the ditch, he pulled the plug.

The vindictiveness toward Rick is personal in my opinion.  It's true that he made a couple of bad hires but I believe that the good has far outweighed the bad.

First the good.  Rick Villareal has been by far the most productive Athletic Director in our history.  Or, at least since Theron Fouts; the AD when I first became a student.  Everything in the Mean Green Village has Rick's fingerprints on it.  The only things in place when he came here was a dilapidated golf course and a willingness to buy the Liberty Christian property if the price was right.  In addition to the new structures and improvements to existing structures that were at LCHS, he was responsible for the learning center, basketball practice facility and forthcoming improvements to the Super Pit.  Moving from the Sun Belt to Conference USA also came under his watch.  He secured $20 million toward the new stadium and several million dollar donors.  I believe that he did all this on a balanced budget.  

Maybe CBL is right on this.  It could be that the administration owes him the dignity of finishing out his contract.  

 

[Green P1]

Ya know... The banner is a good idea based upon the other even worse ideas they could have come up with. 

[rcade]

RV's contract is up in something like eighteen months.  If you were successful in getting Rick removed it would cost the university somewhere in the vicinity of a half-million dollars.

If RV hires the next coach and it's another one of his "good hires," it'll cost UNT far more than that.

What's the point of the great stadium and all the other facility improvements if we win 28% of our games? The point of the plan was to turn UNT football into the kind of program you'd expect at a school of 37,000 that is the biggest university in a metroplex of 6.9 million people. Instead, it's 2015 and we're still looking up with envy towards schools like Tulsa.

Edited October 22, 2015 by rcade

[EagleMBA]

"RV has done a lot for this university, but he is now unfit to continue to lead the Athletic Department. Like in any business environment, things change and you must adapt. The landscape he was hired to work in has radically changed and he has not adapted to it. His dedication to get UNT off the ground and into the realm of big time athletics, both in affiliation and facilities, should be lauded. That does not supersede the other issues at hand.  As the head of an organization, he ultimately is the one who takes the blame and the one who receives the credit. Past accolades only get you so far in life and unfortunately he has used up his existing goodwill."

Thanks, Lax. That reminded me that many years ago I worked for a North Texas alum who always praised me with "Attaboy!" when I did something good; then he would say "But it takes ten Attaboys to make up for one Awshit. So keep pushing."

[Aldo]

You people don't get how irrelevant we are in the sports world at the moment. 

Isn't that why the banner is flying? It'll make the rounds. Dead flying cats and Drake playing Wii tennis makes the rounds.

[GRN-WHT]

Isn't that why the banner is flying? It'll make the rounds. Dead flying cats and Drake playing Wii tennis makes the rounds.

That's exactly why the banner is flying, but the banner isn't going to make the national media suddenly care about us.

[EagleMBA]

Ya know... The banner is a good idea based upon the other even worse ideas they could have come up with. 

Teacher! Teacher! How about this one...the next game is Halloween!

 

[FirefightnRick]

Apogee and it's $20 million was cultivated by a search firm hired by the university...not athletics.

The Warranch Tennis complex was unsolicited but eventually cultivated by the university fundraising efforts..(Advancement)...not athletics, and was supposed to be completed at a later date.  It's later.......like 8-10 years later?,... and the center championship court is still a grassy sticker patch.

 

-sigh- at the countless bits of misinformation.

 

Rick

Edited October 22, 2015 by FirefightnRick

[UNT Five&Dime]

I just feel bad for all the people who are sitting in Apogee watching the warm-ups, that lean back to see what message is being flown above and realize their paid-for chairbacks are still not installed as they fall back and hit their head.

[Gibbz]

If the major press picks up on this

HA! Right

[Got5onIt]

Dont' you see, this is EXACTLY what RV wants. He wants infighting @ GMG so the entire group would end up looking like a bunch of jackasses from an outsider's perspective.  :P

[Tyler Maryak]

I'm starting to really regret requesting one email to comment on this thread...lol

[gangrene]

I don't really have an opinion on the banner, but I fail to see how this is any different from creating a firemackbrown.com website or the countless other things fan bases have done to voice their displeasure.  Even Idaho is taking action:

Frustrated Idaho Fan Fills Campus With Flyers Calling For Paul Petrino's Firing

Disgruntled Miami fans flew the funniest Al Golden banner over the stadium

Wake Forest fans take out billboard calling for firing of coach Jeff Bzdelik

Michigan fans march on UM president's home calling for the firing of coach Brady Hoke and AD Dave Brandon

 

 

[KingDL1]

There seems to be a lot of drama here, it is just a banner and if some people start asking some questions I am all for it. but for anyone outside this university it will not matter a bit, they will say at most it looks like some fans are pissed off with how things are. At least someone cares. Mole hill turns to mountain, if only a banner was as powerful as all this. 

Edited October 22, 2015 by KingDL1

[Graddean]

After all of this time, I still don't know what this is supposed to do.  Do we really believe the President and the BOR  are not aware of the strong feelings many supporters have.  If so, we have a bigger problem than RV.  The President is not going to take out an ad in the paper or some other public notice.  How do we expect people to want our coaching job with threats of non support because of the AD or be considered to be a loser because the AD MADE THE CHOICE.  This is not to support RV but to support the President's ability to do what is best for UNT.

[FirefightnRick]

I just feel bad for all the people who are sitting in Apogee watching the warm-ups, that lean back to see what message is being flown above and realize their paid-for chairbacks are still not installed as they fall back and hit their head.

ROTFLMAO!!!!

 

Rick

[rcade]

Do we really believe the President and the BOR  are not aware of the strong feelings many supporters have.

What evidence have you seen that Smatresk and the board are aware that we're running a 28% successful football program and a lot of fans are demanding a change higher than just the coach?

All I see from UNT leadership is business as usual comments and implicit support for RV.

[GRN-WHT]

What evidence have you seen that Smatresk and the board are aware that we're running a 28% successful football program and a lot of fans are demanding a change higher than just the coach?

All I see from UNT leadership is business as usual comments and implicit support for RV.

Exactly my point. We have zero evidence that anybody is listening to us.

[Cr1028]

You know what would envelope me with positivity??? RV getting relieved of his AD duties so we can move on from this debacle .

Outside of maybe a couple hundred people, nobody would care.

[EagleMBA]

A sharing of random thoughts that have been in the back of my mind for a few days and won't go away, not necessarily planted there in this thread:

Hmmm. Several people have been very adamant about not flying a banner. Some seem on the verge of soiling themselves when describing the perceived consequences of the act, allusions to ineffectiveness, admonishments concerning vague unintended consequences. Some calm, measured and professional; some angry.  Attempts to spin focus into a personal attack. Hmmm. The banner seems relatively innocuous to me; relatively common event in FBS sports at FBS schools. Hmmm. Makes me very suspicious. What do these people know that I don't know? Hmmm.

[3XNTGRAD]

Harry - well said.  Thanks for posting this.

[greenminer]

Someone create a black shirt with the text, line-by-line, stating in bold letters the records of every single major sports hire RV has made the last 10 years.

[Side Show Joe]

Outside of maybe a couple hundred people, nobody would care.

I think you are getting to the root of our problem and why those that want RV gone have a strong argument.

1. After over a decade as our AD, we only have a couple hundred members of the Mean Green Club, so that minority RV has spoken about could actually be the majority of the Mean Green Club.

2. Nobody cares because we lose too much, and those in charge have historically been okay with that.

[UNT90]

I am against the banner.  I think it is petty and mean spirited.   I contributed to the banner we flew in support of the team at SMU.  I will not contribute to this.  I said as much last night on the podcast but I feel compelled to put it down in words.

I understand and respect the right of people to voice their opinions and believe in free speech.  But this thing has gone too far.  If the major press picks up on this, I believe it it will ultimately embarrass and humiliate the university.  So I implore the fans who are participating in this misguided project to please step down.  Lay down your sword.  You've made your position known -- you don't have to turn the knife again.  Stop it now before more damage is done.

I do think many of the participants are good fans and truly believe that this Flag is the right thing to do but I believe they are misguided.  I think this Banner spells out one message very clearly and that message is ANARCHY.  This is not the type of message we need to be communicating when we are trying to hire a new coach who hopefully will take us to the next level.  This is not the message we need to portray to our students and the rest of the world.

My advisement is you put your faith in the leadership at UNT and in this case that is our President Dr. Smatresk.   He may not be responding to every letter and email (God forbid he has a pretty busy job), but I believe he is listening and taking it into his account.  He is not ignoring you.  This is the honorable way to deal with this situation.  If you did not like the way he responded to your first letter write another one.  Call his office, Call the BOR Call Lee Jackson whoever, but please do not air our dirty laundry publicly for all to see (including future coaches).

I would like us to land the very best football coach that we can, and I think we can do that.  The president obviously believes that we are best positioned to do that with RV at the helm or he would have already made a change.   This whole Flag thing takes away from that very important coaching discussion -- which I believe is a whole lot more important in the grand scheme of things.  As CBL wisely pointed out there could be other things going on behind the scenes that require the leadership to handle this particular situation as they are.  As hard as it may be we need to trust them to do the right thing.

Many of you state you tried to contact Smatresk and since he did not respond directly to you this Flag is your only option.  I don't think that is true, rather it is just an excuse to try to humiliate RV publicly.  And if it is truly the reason, should this not be a fire Smatresk flag?  I mean, isn't he the one who is not responding to your concerns?  Is not he the one who made the decision to keep RV in his position?  Why does Smatresk get a pass here?  I think the answer is it does not fit your agenda.

The banner will hurt RV personally more than anything else.  There is a feeding frenzy that is getting ugly here.  Believe me --  I understand people are frustrated -  but I honestly believe this is not the way to handle it.  In fact, I will say it now, not one good thing will come of this.. not one good thing.  I also think it will bring more negativity to our University in this very short window we have to hire a good coach.  And let me be clear -- I don't think it will change a thing.  The money could be spent in better ways in my opinion.

If you will not take my word on this, then how about the courageous former athlete who came on here and spoke from her heart?  I think she eloquently stated the situation far better than I ever could.  It feels wrong...dirty.   I believe deep down, many of the participants don't feel right about this and my hope is they will come to their senses and call this thing off.

GMG

This is not to humiliate anyone publicly. 

RV has a much bigger voice than the average fan. Even after the poll here on GMG (and probably because of it), he met with Vito and intentionally tried to marginalize the opinion of many rank and file fans. I believe that was a driving force behind this banner (maybe I'm wrong). It was his own arrogance that upset so many, and I have a feeling those people are going to be more upset when Scott Sidway's article is published. Again, I could be wrong. 

I think many people underestimate the damage done by the Portland St. game. That was the worst loss in college football history. That was the tipping point. 

As far as future coaches, maybe it shows them the fan base actually gives a shit about the program. Maybe it shows them they can't come here and play a family friend's son at QB when he clearly isn't capable. Maybe they will realize they need to do everything possible to win. 

And here is some news for you dissenters. This would have happened at a major program after the dodge and Benford hire (you know, the guy that is still here?). And no one would have given it a second thought.

One problem is people are afraid this will embarrass RV. It shouldn't embarrass him more than the worst loss in college football history, should it? It shouldn't embarrass him more than his coaching hires, should it? 

Its a banner. And right now, it's flying one day. 

And many of us believe it needs to happen. 

[Eagle-96]

100%. They feel like he personally wronged them.

He did personally wrong me, and every other graduate and student of UNT, by turning us into the laughing stock of college sports.